# Alternate Explanations of Pheromone Overdose **URL:** \ **Category:** Pheromone Theory & Molecules\ **Created:** [August 17, 2007, 4:25am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/alternate-explanations-of-pheromone-overdose/5130 "2007-08-17T04:25:24Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 1\ **Showing post:** 19
**Author:** ![Socrates](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/3bc359/32.png) [@Socrates](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/Socrates)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2007, 12:54pm UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/alternate-explanations-of-pheromone-overdose/5130/19 "2007-09-11T12:54:20Z")
> [@MarkL](#): > > A few nights ago I decide to stop in my favorite ‘all lifestyles circus’ bar on the way home from work. I pause outside and rustle through my rucksack … and all I find is EST (50mcg/spray) and TAF(50mcg/spray) and -Androsterone 15mcg. I skip the -Androsterone and apply EST 8x50=400 and TAF 2x50=100 and I decide as I enter to be fairly self-contained in the bar: > > - some quiet conversation with my barkeep buddy Chad > - browse a newspaper/magazine > - make some notes on a project > Nothing particularly goal-oriented; I’m passing time, waiting constructively. I’m **not** wandering around saying hello to people I know or introducing myself to strangers; the bar is a bit on the quiet side (pop\<30) anyway. I’m observing people in the bar and make no secret of enjoying them as they do their thing; I’m not being reclusive or sending off ‘hermit signals’. > > Except for trips to the bathroom or to get popcorn, I’m sitting in my own pherocloud next to the front service counter rather than leaving a trail. I’m quiet, sipping on a large stein of Bass Ale for an hour. > > Then a four-set rocks in, two gay boys (Shaun, Brian) and two girls (Lisa, Jenya). Lisa is visiting from New York, and she decides I embody the best of Chicago. If you use a stopwatch, you can measure that over the next two hours the total time Lisa is ~not~ touching me is under one minute. > > Ummm … no one that I know, not even the Kinsey scale 5.999 gay boys, would throw Lisa out of bed. > > The kino is great; at one point she manages to brush both of her mamms across my cheek on the way to leaning over my lap to hug another boy, Dana, who joins late. > > The housecleaning we do is mental; one after another critical topic is raised, inspected, sorted, dismissed: politics to religion to economy to social mores and anthropology. > > She makes it a point to tell me twice about how a policeman stopped their group while she was skinny-dipping at the beach (after the park was closed) … and how she emerged, topless, and announced to the cop that if he was going to arrest her, he better know how to show her a good time with the handcuffs on. 🙄 > > The posse that arrived with her finally returns from the back bar (and pool tables) after about 90 minutes. They are in two modes – one is to rescue me (or Lisa) because Lisa is becoming progressively drunk, and the other, it seems, is to figure out why the hell she’s so engaged with me in the first place. > > So Lisa tutors her friends on what they’ve been missing while they left her alone and too bad for them, it’s their loss. I observe that the front door to the place is only 35" wide, so please go easy on the ego inflating comments. > > Now we evolve from Lisa-MarkL kino to a very fluid group hug. Brian gives me a shoulder rub that I’d have paid hard cash for, my toes curl; Shaun opens up and we’re all trading warm “open hand” touches – back, arms, chests/breasts, though Jenya is a bit more reserved. (I’ve not witnessed such a scene in this venue in three - odd years, let alone participated. Perhaps I’ve been visiting on the wrong days! 🆒This lasts for about two minutes, then spins away.) > > The IOIs are thick .. it’s like a group flirting convention, and casual bystanders are now being sucked into the vortex. > > In any case, I did not foresee that the EST/TAF combo would generate such a strong hit. And one that I did virtually no work for. EST, I thought, was a “comfortable for guys” vibe, but apparently there’s more to it. Thanks Mark excellent feedback as usual! **I really wish more people would do these kind of creative ‘pheromone event’ experiments instead of writing forum reports on the same dosages IS, IFM, TUTH etc for the 1 millionth time! I would love to hear more experiments of megadosing [putative pheromones](https://pheromonelabs.com/product-category/advanced-pheromones/putative-pheromones/)…** It is interesting that the ‘megadose’ EST/TAF combo had such a great effect for you. But it is not completely unexpected. Estratetraenol, does seem to affect women as well from those in the know (see the old posts pasted in below from tacitus and sigma). TAF is also known as a potent intensifier (see the oldtime posts pasted below from MHarris and tacitus). Now a megadose of the two would likely drive things insane given what has been said below about some of the reactions from EST and high-dose TAF (for example see tacitus’ identified ‘neurotic’ effect of too much TAF in his March 5, 2006 post). [before we move on, could we review the PUTATIVES ? - #13 by tacitus](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/before-we-move-on-could-we-review-the-putatives/476/13) ([before we move on, could we review the PUTATIVES ? - #13 by tacitus](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/before-we-move-on-could-we-review-the-putatives/476/13)) tacitus (July 8, 2006): “…OTOH I’ve also observed that good old EST ([https://phera.com/](https://phera.com/)) will add a super friendly, approachable, initmate vibe to the proceedings… [EST](https://phera.com/) is like a powerful sweetener… I’ve seen women literally get up and start dancing around saying the most outrageous uninhibited stuff in the presence of [EST](https://phera.com/) and [P74](https://a314.com/product/p74/)… hard to believe we are looking at **millionths of a gram** here…” > [@More Estratetraenol feedback](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/more-estratetraenol-feedback/301/17): > > The EST blathers versus the b-nol blathers EST has resulted in a couple of downloads of highly unfiltered mental material.. without the deep revelatory mind flushing of b-nol… EST can produce the state of high rapport, or perceived high rapport, that the blatherer can just go off saying anything and everything that comes to mind without fully checking in with the blatheree…(this is where your NLP Calibration Skills can come in mighty handy, pardner) this of course is higher tinctures of EST… fo… tacitus (July 12, 2006): " **The EST blathers versus the b-Androstenol blathers** [EST](https://phera.com/) has resulted in a couple of downloads of highly unfiltered mental material.. without the deep revelatory mind flushing of b-Androstenol… [EST](https://phera.com/) can produce the state of high rapport, or perceived high rapport, that the blatherer can just go off saying anything and everything that comes to mind **without fully checking in with the blatheree** …(this is where your **NLP Calibration Skills can come in mighty handy** , pardner) this of course is higher tinctures of [EST](https://phera.com/)… for general purposes I would keep the dose restrained around 20 [mu](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microgram) until you are sure you like what behaviors you are experiencing… and for goodness sake don’t use to much when you go to a warmed up bar scene **unless you want to hear in glorious surround sound every thought, opinion, reflection, mental itch scratching, inner rumble, cliche, and platitude that person has been storing up in his or her head for just this occasion…** I am coming to the idea that there should be therapeutic blather bars with special acoustics and psychologists floating around handing out canapes and wholesome advice while the blather-noviates take great whiffs of [EST](https://phera.com/) and disgorge their entire psyches for the room to behold…" [https://pheromonetalk.com/t/before-we-move-on-could-we-review-the-putatives/476/54](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/before-we-move-on-could-we-review-the-putatives/476/54) tacitus (July 21, 2006): “…EST ([https://phera.com/](https://phera.com/)) on the other hand is a flat out empathogen, people can feel understanding and well understood and at ease, sometimes so at ease they forget to censor their behavior…” > [@More Estratetraenol feedback](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/more-estratetraenol-feedback/301/8): > > From what I can tell about EST, it seems to put everyone around you in high spirits - works great as a social mone. The effects seem similar to that of the effects of A1 on women, though not as intimate or personal…more energetic, but “chilled”. One thing that I noticed today while wearing it, is that it creates a very ‘carefree’ mood on the people around you, as well as seeming to make people want to be around you. I grabbed a large table for myself and a friend at a starbucks on campus to f… sigma (April 24, 2006): "From what I can tell about [EST](https://phera.com/), it seems to put everyone around you in high spirits - works great as a social pheromone. The effects seem similar to that of the effects of [Androstadienone](https://pheromonelabs.com/product/molecule-a/) on women, though not as intimate or personal…more energetic, but “chilled”. One thing that I noticed today while wearing it, is that it creates a very ‘carefree’ mood on the people around you, as well as seeming to make people want to be around you. I grabbed a large table for myself and a friend at a starbucks on campus to finish up a paper for one of my classes, and before I knew it, I had 5-6 of my friends sitting at the table with us. One of the girls ended up skipping her class (lol). The downside is I’ve had trouble getting my paper started..and feelings of being ‘carefree’ sometimes feel like feelings of ‘apathy’. The girl who hung back to study with me only now started seriously getting any studying…we spent the last two hours BS’ing around…and I, instead of finishing my paper, got side-tracked by this forum, and ended up posting this very entry. I could be just looking for something to attribute my end of the semester slump though. [Instant Honesty](https://a314.com/product/instant-honesty/)+EST gave me a bigger high than IS+EST. From what I can tell, [EST](https://phera.com/) seems to enhance the social benefits of both [Instant Honesty](https://a314.com/product/instant-honesty/) and IS" > [@Estratetraenol: is it available for purchase yet, and if not, when?](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/estratetraenol/204/43): > > Aside from the uplifting effects that EST has, EST seems to facilitate communication and interaction with others. People just seem to genuinely enjoy being around you and talking to you, and you feel genuinely more open to those around you…its kind of a hard phenomenon to describe, but once they get in your general vicinity, its like they don’t want to leave. I also find myself speaking up more often in class, and striking up casual conversation with strangers. At times it feels like EST act… sigma (May 1, 2006): "Aside from the uplifting effects that [EST](https://phera.com/) has, [EST](https://phera.com/) seems to facilitate communication and interaction with others. People just seem to genuinely enjoy being around you and talking to you, and you feel genuinely more open to those around you…its kind of a hard phenomenon to describe, but once they get in your general vicinity, its like they don’t want to leave. I also find myself speaking up more often in class, and striking up casual conversation with strangers. At times it feels like [EST](https://phera.com/) actually enhances the effects of other pheromones, at least the effect that they have on me. I really can’t confirm that though. I used to wear 2 sprays, but 3 sprays has been more beneficial. One day I should go all out and wear 5 sprays just to see what really happens. Has anyone else tried [EST](https://phera.com/)?" > [@I'm a pheromone newbie](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/im-a-pheromone-newbie/696/2): > > Looks like most of the products you’ve picked up are of a more sexual nature, and doesn’t quite align with your said goals. You should see some interesting results around the wife though. wink Influence people in what manner? If I’m reading you correctly, it sounds like you’re looking for more of a boost socially than sexually.. For your purposes, I would have recommended CTTM2, IS, and A314…or perhaps, IO, IH, IS, and A314. These products are more socially oriented and are more suited to … sigma (September 24, 2006): “…[Estratetraenol](https://phera.com/) is a great social pheromones as well. It creates a sort of social magnetism, as well as creating an uplifted vibe. Some report that its effects are more biased towards men. I’ve noticed this to some degree, but it worked quite well overall for me…” [sexmix adventures](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/sex-mix-adventures/91/2) MHarris (January 8, 2006): "…You honed in on the subtleties of [TAF](https://pheromonelabs.com/) quickly! I don’t know if I’ve covered this publicly yet or not, but it’s actually a key ingredient added to many our products. It’s there in what may seem like small amounts, but it makes them burn a little brighter. While large amounts of [TAF](https://pheromonelabs.com/) are insane, even nanogram amounts in a phero dose can change a mix. It’s a highly active intensifer. [TAF](https://pheromonelabs.com/) is also an excellent modifier when you want to bring out the character of a single pheromone, or discover new nuances of one you supposedly know well…" [4 drops of A314 (base), 2 IS, 2 Come Talk To Me Mix 2, and 1 Meo-Est (went out to a dance).](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/4-drops-of-a314-base-2-is-2-cttm2-and-1-meo-est-went-out-to-a-dance/156/28) tacitus (February 26, 2006): " [![](https://pheromonetalk.com/mens-pheromone-advice-tricks-tips/images/icons/icon1.gif) ](https://pheromonetalk.com/mens-pheromone-advice-tricks-tips/images/icons/icon1.gif) **I have ! I have !** didn’t accomplish much outside of the norm… I think Jasmin has particularly strong responses to dopamine. Instead of being sexual, [TAF](https://pheromonelabs.com/) makes me too intellectual, it is a “snap out of it” phero. Minute doses of [TAF](https://pheromonelabs.com/) do improve other phero mixes… it’s the monosodium glutamate, what is that flavor additive I have in my kitchen ? Accent flavor enhancer, you put it in soup and gravy for a bigger meatier taste… [TAF](https://pheromonelabs.com/) is like that." [tee hee hee…MEO-EST made me do it!](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/tee-hee-hee-meo-est-made-me-do-it/179/10) tacitus (March 5, 2006): “…Hmmmmm… definitely an autonomic response… it might be a small dose as catalyst pheromone, like [TAF](https://pheromonelabs.com/) works for me… add in a speck of it to another mix and you have attentiveness, engagement… too much and you feel neurotic.” [Let’s visit the Orgasmotron !](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/lets-visit-the-orgasmotron/1572/1) tacitus (January 13, 2007): " [![](https://pheromonetalk.com/mens-pheromone-advice-tricks-tips/images/icons/icon1.gif) ](https://pheromonetalk.com/mens-pheromone-advice-tricks-tips/images/icons/icon1.gif) **Let’s visit the Orgasmotron !** one simple observation… a high empathy/connectivity/rapport mix will let you so massivley dump in the hot male pheromones that you could never get away with… My “acceptance mix” is now a combination of Alpha Androstenol, estratatraenol, [P74](https://a314.com/product/p74/), [P86](https://pheromonelabs.com/), and alpha-Androsterone To which I may add in whatever ( [TAF](https://pheromonelabs.com/) really shoots this business up another 3 notches BTW… I finally got the erotic power of [TAF](https://pheromonelabs.com/)… dagnooshus boy… that’s liquid sin !)… one I have that aura of safety and connection in place, the heat can turn up to glowing orange hot…" [Let’s visit the Orgasmotron !](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/lets-visit-the-orgasmotron/1572/6) tacitus (January 14, 2007): “…On the male sexuous side of the equation, I think this round was the justly praised [P83](https://a314.com/product/p83/), [P91](https://pheromonelabs.com/), [P93](https://a314.com/product/p93/) ramped up with [TAF](https://pheromonelabs.com/)… I beleive these were 50 [mu](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microgram) each… so the whole kit probably came in at around 400 [mu](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microgram) altogether… which by my standards is a nice, middle of the road, managable dose…” [More hi performance communication swill](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/more-hi-performance-communication-swill/1849/14) tacitus (February 1, 2007): “…[TAF](https://pheromonelabs.com/) is very much a sensory enhancer…” --- _[View the full topic](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/alternate-explanations-of-pheromone-overdose/5130)._