# Breaking the friend zone with pheromones: a user guide attempt from Serbia **URL:** \ **Category:** Men's Pheromone Advice & Field Reports\ **Created:** [April 17, 2013, 2:21am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/breaking-the-friend-zone-with-pheromones-a-user-guide-attempt-from-serbia/58768 "2013-04-17T02:21:50Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 5\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![monesmadedoit](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/monesmadedoit/32/325_2.png) [@monesmadedoit](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/monesmadedoit)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2013, 12:35am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/breaking-the-friend-zone-with-pheromones-a-user-guide-attempt-from-serbia/58768/21 "2013-04-21T00:35:00Z")
A user Pm’ed me with a question for this thread. TAL and TAC are both putatives (experimental). TAL is used mostly in women’s products for confidence and in small amounts by men for steering other mones. I’ve not tried it, but hope to eventually. TAC I have tried and really like. Some people probably think of it as a [female pheromone](https://phera.com/), but it’s a superb buffer for None and 75. It creates comfort. How superb? I tested a whopping 60 mcg p75, 20 micros of -eNone and 60 of TAC. Actually, I should have used half as much T A C. No negative issues with men at all, but I think 30 micros is as high as I care to go with 75 for now. Some say the hits are more blatant over 30 micros, but I think I’d need an alphanol or -eRone buffer to see them. ---
**Author:** ![Ragnar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e79b87/32.png) [@Ragnar](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/Ragnar)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2013, 10:26am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/breaking-the-friend-zone-with-pheromones-a-user-guide-attempt-from-serbia/58768/22 "2013-05-16T10:26:08Z")
Related to busting out of the friend zone; A question for MMMDI, if I may; My base mix is A314, A1 and P83, (Commander Kotov’s Nuclear Fallout mix). I keep the A1 to my left forearm (I wear short-sleeved shirts at work) to minimise self-effects, and add 2 sprays of [Instant Shine](https://a314.com/product/shine/) to my neck (again for self effects mainly) plus 1-2 sprays Honesty. Fallout seems to be gathering pace, with my target gradually arranging more and more time together outside of work. I want to slowly ramp up the power of the mix, and gradually introduce some sexual tension. I have to be very careful as she (37 yrs old) was in a psychologically abusive marriage for some years, and when I wore A314 with P75 and Ammo it was just too masculine and powerful for her, and she shied away a little. Mobocaster spotted this possibility, and I cut out the P75 and Ammo, and switched to A1 with 25mcg P83, with great results. Now the cruise missile. I don’t want to go too high on A314 (intimidation), and A1 is not really a sexual. That leaves P83 at a higher dose (I believe it gets sexual above about 30mcg). And the addition of some enone. You pointed out that A1 is an excellent buffer for enone, and that a very low dose of enone can be extremely effective (say 1 mcg). In this case TUTH can be used. In order to accomplish the addition of 1mcg enone as well as increasing the dose of P83, would there be any problem with just mixing my TUTH (2.5mcg) with my P83 (25mcg) in a 50:50 ratio? One spray would then give me 1.25mcg of TUTH and 12.5mcg of P83. This would take my total application of P83 to 37.5mcg. I would use this mix for say 2 weeks, then up the dose to 2 sprays, all the while keeping my base mix as it is. Any problem mixing TUTH with P83? ---
**Author:** ![mobocaster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/c2a13f/32.png) [@mobocaster](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/mobocaster)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2013, 8:57am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/breaking-the-friend-zone-with-pheromones-a-user-guide-attempt-from-serbia/58768/23 "2013-05-17T08:57:49Z")
No problem using TUTH and [P83](https://a314.com/product/p83/) together, although P83 itself won’t really moderate the none in TUTH. However in the right sexual situations it will make getting physical easier. If I’m using P83 and TUTH in the same mix, I will probably have something else in there as a moderator - IH/IS or TAC as a bare minimum and I’ll increase the TUTH proportion as the situation gets more sexual, sometimes quite significantly so depending on the woman. ---
**Author:** ![Ragnar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e79b87/32.png) [@Ragnar](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/Ragnar)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2013, 10:13am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/breaking-the-friend-zone-with-pheromones-a-user-guide-attempt-from-serbia/58768/24 "2013-05-17T10:13:35Z")
Hey Mobocaster, thanks for your input! I wasn’t really looking to the [P83](https://pheromonelabs.com/product/p83/) to moderate the TUTH, as I will also be wearing A314 / A1 / P83 with some Shine and some Honesty anyway. I was looking for a way to slide in a low dose of enone and increase the P83 dose a touch. It just occurred to me that I could use my P83 to dilute my TUTH down to 1.25mcg per spray, just by making up a 50:50 mix. The side benefit of getting another 12.5 mcg pf P83 would then take my total P83 dose to 37.5 mcg, which I believe is getting into the sexual area. I already tried this chemistry set out yesterday and today, and it was almost funny to see the results. My target started to call me “Dear” in front of clients, and kept telling me how wonderful I was. Then, last night at about 10.30pm, six hours after our last contact and totally out of the blue, she sends me a text: “just thought I’d tell you this - you are the greatest friend in the world”. Bear in mind that this relationship is probably pushing the boundaries of what is possible - she is 18 years younger than me, and technically my employee. She has shown signs of interest over the last 6 months, but since I switched to my current mix, she’s become a LOT more flirty and physical. Today, while I was working with a client, my target kept leaning right next to me, leaning in to me, to “see better”. Then she kept tapping my ankles with her foot, pushing me, standing on my foot, etc. She seemed to be craving physical contact. Then she tells me she’s inviting me to dinner with her parents. Finally, just as she was leaving the office, she came over and said she wanted to give me a hug to say thank you (not sure what for), and then gave me a hug that pressed her entire body (i.e.. hips/pelvis) in to mine. Before, her hugs have been “upper body” hugs. So the A314 / A1 / P83 mix seems to be working well, if slowly, and the addition of 1.25mcg TUTH seems to be ramping up the crush. Thanks for confirmation that mixing TUTH and P83 into one bottle won’t cause a problem! ---
**Author:** ![monesmadedoit](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/monesmadedoit/32/325_2.png) [@monesmadedoit](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/monesmadedoit)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2013, 12:23pm UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/breaking-the-friend-zone-with-pheromones-a-user-guide-attempt-from-serbia/58768/25 "2013-05-17T12:23:51Z")
If you are spending time with a woman one-on-one, in cars, at home, at dinner…she’s going to be far more attuned to what you wear. -eNone at .5 mcg per spray would be preferred. You could use P83 as a diluent, 4:1, but IShine or TAC would be superior. P83 really isn’t much of a buffer of anything. Although something like TUTH is a great product with mass appeal, I do better with being able to dose NONE at 2.5 micros per spray **and**.5 . Some will be highly responsive to .5 increments, and some not at all. Testing a few months ago, I was stunned at how well my diluted Heavy AMMO (in ethanol, to deliver .5 mcg NONE per spray) worked. Adding just about 1 mcg to P75 really produced incredible hits. Three good looking women aged 21-35 looked like this addition was a panty soaker. You could see it. It was like remote control orgasm. I’m going to do some dilution/volume experiments again. You’d be amazed how well covering a large surface area with just 1 mcg really works. Also, having overhead ventilation/fans helps. This is universal in FL, whereas in the north, floor registers are favored. Climate is a huge mones factor. Saturated air can’t hold mones, for the same reason 100% humidity causes fog. I made a huge post on this in my journal “Pheromones Philosophy.” Everything is so different here vs UK with bars and whatnot. Try it some time. Try diluting your favorite mone way down, then dosing the WHOLE mix all over your arms, neck and hair (keep None off the hair). There is some sage wisdom from veterans, especially Mobocaster. However, I’ve also come to learn that some stuff about diffusion and pee smells are wives tales. I’ve smelled the pee odor with AMMO, but never pure -eNone. I’m not anosmic. The None in different products is **not** all created equally. For all I know, several of the putatives and T’s may be just different synthesis of the same molecule. I’ll be damned (maybe so) if P75 isn’t like these (or an erone conjugate). I wish we had more scientists, physicists, chemists, doctors and so forth here. So often, I just hear stuff about mones that’s unscientific. The way you layer products does matter. Hydrogen bond forces with mixed or layered mones do matter. It’s all right there in perfumery textbooks. Michael Harris talked about perfume companies that employ chemical physicists. My point is that None is highly individualized. I don’t think any two women respond differently. If I want to seduce a woman, I go for fallout and then gradually test her None tolerance, .5 at a time. If she’s good with 2.5, then I can move to 2.5 per spray. In clubs, I go for a signature shotgun mix (journal post this this weekend). It OD’s some women but grasps the horny ones. I am total velcro for any and all women in relationships. The single ones skip bars and hide behind five layers of social media. Can’t hardly get at 'em. They pick and choose. The only downside of using fallout mixes in clubs is that the closeted (and some not so closeted) gays are bug-zapper drawn to the stuff like an eerie ultraviolet glow. Then the homosexual (nothing personal) sycophants completely thwart my objectives. OTOH, companies could market this. P74 is gay velcro…and great for women as well. Break the rules (just a little). [Previous page](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/breaking-the-friend-zone-with-pheromones-a-user-guide-attempt-from-serbia/58768.md?page=1)