# Hello, some questions, and some skepticism **URL:** \ **Category:** Introductions - New Users, Say "Hello"!\ **Created:** [August 8, 2011, 4:21pm UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/hello-some-questions-and-some-skepticism/51682 "2011-08-08T16:21:25Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 16\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![ouroborous](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/47e85d/32.png) [@ouroborous](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/ouroborous)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2011, 4:21pm UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/hello-some-questions-and-some-skepticism/51682/1 "2011-08-08T16:21:25Z")
First of all, hello! I’m a 41 year old male who would like to spice up his sex life a little (before getting too deep/too far gone into middle age for it to matter!) A little about me. I’ve always been a brainy, low-testosterone type. And by low-testosterone, I mean that medically; the median total T for a male my age is about 600 ng/dl, and my first measurement was 50 ng/dl! After treating some medical conditions and losing 110 lbs, my current total T is about 550 ng/dl, which is much closer to “normal.” However, testosterone is a complicated beast; it doesn’t just make you horny and sprout hair, it signals masculinity and dominance, which are two things that I’ve ALWAYS felt lacking in. Despite being a straight guy, I’ve never been much of an “alpha male” – I don’t just mean the stupid stereotype of banging your chest and getting into fights. I mean things like self-confidence, assertiveness with the opposite sex, and so on. I tend to be the shy wallflower type, not the “go get the girl” type. And I think that women pick up on it; women really like me (I’m smart, and kind, and funny, and not too horrible on the eyes) but I get this “I like you like a brother” thing over and over. From what I can tell, women don’t get that sexual frisson from me, and I want to be able to feel that a bit before I’m too damned old to play! So, the weight loss – and I will say that that’s been the single best thing for my self esteem and masculinity ever – and now I’m playing with pheromones. I’ve tried NPA, but I’m pretty convinced that it’s worthless; I put it on “neat” but I’ve detected absolutely ZERO change in behavior towards me at all; neither positive or negative, or anything. I believe that human pheromones exist and can work, but I also believe that probably 90% of what gets sold on the market is just junk – pure rubbing alcohol or cologne or simple skin creams with no bioactive additives. In short, while I believe in the SCIENCE of human pheromones, I think that most companies selling [pheromone products](https://a314.com/shop/) are fraudulent (we need the FDA to regulate this stuff). Case in point, the NPA that I got has NO smell at all, aside from rubbing alcohol. Not pleasant or unpleasant, just… alcohol smell. I know that I’m supposed to mix it, but from what I understand, the problem with not mixing it is that it might come on too strong and provoke negative reactions – no. Nothing. Zip. Since there’s no smell but rubbing alcohol, I’m pretty convinced that the NPA I got was just a bottle of rubbing alcohol (I shook it before using it, too, just in case). So I’ve ordered some products from another company that’s well-regarded here. I’ll end this rambling post by looking for suggestions. I don’t really go in for the “bar scene” (I don’t drink), and although I like sex I’m not looking for a lot of one-night stands. I’m just looking for some more attention from women, and not the “like a brother” kind. I’m looking for a bit more respect from my fellow men. And most of all, I’m looking for that shot of self-confidence – just a touch of that “alpha male” swagger (without all the pathetic frat boy antics) before I get too old to enjoy it. Any recommendations? I’m pretty much done with NPA, so recommendations for competing products that are not likely to simply be pure placebo would be very welcome. ---
**Author:** ![mobocaster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/c2a13f/32.png) [@mobocaster](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/mobocaster)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2011, 4:34pm UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/hello-some-questions-and-some-skepticism/51682/2 "2011-08-08T16:34:30Z")
Why not go and repost this in the intro forum? That way you will get a $25 GC - which will help to offset the cost of your first purchases. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![ouroborous](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/47e85d/32.png) [@ouroborous](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/ouroborous)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2011, 4:48pm UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/hello-some-questions-and-some-skepticism/51682/3 "2011-08-08T16:48:36Z")
> [@mobocaster](#): > > Why not go and repost this in the intro forum? > > That way you will get a $25 GC - which will help to offset the cost of your first purchases. 🙂 Oops, I thought this was the right forum. I’ll repost there – thanks for the heads up! ---
**Author:** ![John\_Sebastian](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/john_sebastian/32/1060_2.png) [@John\_Sebastian](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/John_Sebastian)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2011, 4:51pm UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/hello-some-questions-and-some-skepticism/51682/4 "2011-08-08T16:51:01Z")
> [@ouroborous](#): > > Oops, I thought this was the right forum. I’ll repost there – thanks for the heads up! Wait, I’ll move this one for you! ---
**Author:** ![John\_Sebastian](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/john_sebastian/32/1060_2.png) [@John\_Sebastian](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/John_Sebastian)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2011, 4:53pm UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/hello-some-questions-and-some-skepticism/51682/5 "2011-08-08T16:53:36Z")
> [@John\_Sebastian](#): > > Wait, I’ll move this one for you! Ok, there you go! 🙂 BTW Real quick: Skepticism is healthy as long as you are open minded about the results, no matter what they are. Enjoy! 🆒 ---
**Author:** ![ouroborous](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/47e85d/32.png) [@ouroborous](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/ouroborous)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2011, 5:00pm UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/hello-some-questions-and-some-skepticism/51682/6 "2011-08-08T17:00:02Z")
Well technically skepticism should be the default position until a randomized, controlled double-blind study is done (one group with NPA, one group with NPA + cologne, one group with cologne only, one group with rubbing alcohol only, one group with nothing) and some sort of objective review criteria are determined (what objective criteria determines a “hit?”) and so on. But since my time and resources are limited, and I already believe that there IS a scientific underpinning, I just want to find what products are legit, and what works for me. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Sebastian](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/john_sebastian/32/1060_2.png) [@John\_Sebastian](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/John_Sebastian)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2011, 5:14pm UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/hello-some-questions-and-some-skepticism/51682/7 "2011-08-08T17:14:28Z")
> [@ouroborous](#): > > Well technically skepticism should be the default position until a randomized, controlled double-blind study is done (one group with NPA, one group with NPA + cologne, one group with cologne only, one group with rubbing alcohol only, one group with nothing) and some sort of objective review criteria are determined (what objective criteria determines a “hit?”) and so on. > > But since my time and resources are limited, and I already believe that there IS a scientific underpinning, I just want to find what products are legit, and what works for me. We do blind tests as part of our MX series. We don’t sell or make NPA, but you can find our own products have been rigorously tested. This forum is considered a research forum as AD is primarily a research company. ---
**Author:** ![ouroborous](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/47e85d/32.png) [@ouroborous](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/ouroborous)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2011, 5:30pm UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/hello-some-questions-and-some-skepticism/51682/8 "2011-08-08T17:30:06Z")
No offense intended, but I’m ALWAYS skeptical of the claims of anyone who’s selling things. As soon as I see a shopping cart link, my first response is to leave the site and start doing some Googling (and with stuff that’s “sciency” my first stop is usually Google Scholar). That being said, I’m willing to try a few more “non-blind, non-controlled,” completely unscientific studies of my own before moving on to more old-fashioned ways (weight lifting, fat loss, positive self-talk, blah blah) of feeling like an alpha-male. Or just admit I’m not “that guy” and grow old gracefully. … nah 😉 ---
**Author:** ![John\_Sebastian](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/john_sebastian/32/1060_2.png) [@John\_Sebastian](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/John_Sebastian)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2011, 5:41pm UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/hello-some-questions-and-some-skepticism/51682/9 "2011-08-08T17:41:35Z")
> [@ouroborous](#): > > No offense intended, but I’m ALWAYS skeptical of the claims of anyone who’s selling things. As soon as I see a shopping cart link, my first response is to leave the site and start doing some Googling (and with stuff that’s “sciency” my first stop is usually Google Scholar). > > That being said, I’m willing to try a few more “non-blind, non-controlled,” completely unscientific studies of my own before moving on to more old-fashioned ways (weight lifting, fat loss, positive self-talk, blah blah) of feeling like an alpha-male. Or just admit I’m not “that guy” and grow old gracefully. > > … nah 😉 Not offended at all. 🙂 We are open and honest about the fact that this is our forum. But we don’t moderate bad reviews or delete posts based on skepticism as you may see in other places. All 25k+ real people and posts. Google probably has more scams then this forum. I’ve recently had to report several fake review sites to the FTC that I found spamming us. Three this morning. 😮 So no offense taken, I know you will find what you’re looking for. 🙂 You should be getting your free $25 gift certificate shortly. ---
**Author:** ![mobocaster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/c2a13f/32.png) [@mobocaster](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/mobocaster)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2011, 5:41pm UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/hello-some-questions-and-some-skepticism/51682/10 "2011-08-08T17:41:50Z")
TBH most of us were suspicious of the claims for pheros in the human context and many had experienced some of the poorer quality/shonky products out there - Sold with grand claims that didn’t amount to much. In one way I was lucky, I bought a “sexual” product from one firm that turned out to be Beta Androstenol - A key ingredient of many of the social mixes. Although it was sold with totally surplus claims, it was a decent quality phero and I soon found a lot of different but broadly positive responses and investigating them brought me to this forum. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![ouroborous](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/47e85d/32.png) [@ouroborous](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/ouroborous)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2011, 6:07pm UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/hello-some-questions-and-some-skepticism/51682/11 "2011-08-08T18:07:16Z")
Yeah, that’s exactly what I’m hoping for. I’ve read enough studies of [pheromone](https://pheromonelabs.com/) influence on human behavior to believe that there’s SOMETHING there – I’m SUPER skeptical and pretty cynical about Internet product claims, so that’s saying something. But I also think that it’s probably not as simple as “put a dab of this on and you’ll be a CHICK MAGNET!” From lurking here for a bit, it seems like most of you are in the same camp – you guys seem to be saying that you have to experiment and do some trial and error, and I’m totally willing to do that. I also need to find a super, super light cologne, because a pet theory of mine is that simply _smelling good_ (with or without pheromones) is a confidence/sexuality booster, but that’s a whole separate discussion (I think!) Anyway, thanks (both of you!) for the responses. Hopefully this will be an interesting journey. ---
**Author:** ![1Alpha](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/1alpha/32/190_2.png) [@1Alpha](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/1Alpha)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2011, 6:41pm UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/hello-some-questions-and-some-skepticism/51682/12 "2011-08-08T18:41:02Z")
Welcome to the forum, ouroborous! If you look up CK’s posts, you’ll see that he prescribes to his Chick Magnet combo’s. Initially, it takes time and observations to form correlations to the mones. From your posts on your social positions with the gals, my first suggestion is for you start with AMMO. My results with this are a vibe of a sexy, confident man coming through. I could normally enjoy wearing it during the day or evening. Though, as you also mention your search for a ‘super light cologne’… then, as AMMO is 20% cologne strength… you can either, take it as it is… or get a custom bottle of AMMO with 6% cologne strength. As the scent is the carrier for the mones, I’d recommend you start with at least the 6% cologne strength. If you are looking for blatant reactions, I’d suggest IJ as a cure for skepticism. This gives me an aggressive and cocky self effect with men becoming short tempered with me and testing my position. The gals I’m around, for the most part, are intimidated by the IJ vibe. To give you a better handle on all things mone, if you haven’t already, I’d suggest you take a look at the Intro to Mones in my sig as well as How do I know what are hits?! by Tisha. You likely already have your own idea of what constitutes a ‘hit’. I still recommend these threads for you. Also, to have an understanding of the commercial line of mones provided by AD, also take a look at P51’s thread on my sig below as well. I’m interested to know what you think of the mones you test out! 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![ouroborous](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/47e85d/32.png) [@ouroborous](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/ouroborous)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2011, 5:51pm UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/hello-some-questions-and-some-skepticism/51682/13 "2011-08-12T17:51:44Z")
Sadly so far, I’m seeing zero effect from any of the 'mones I bought. As in no reactions whatsoever – positive or negative – with various combinations and applications of some/all of the following: A337 (or whatever it’s called) TUTH IO IS None of them produce any noticeable change in behavior from anyone I’m around. I’ll keep experimenting and report back, but right now I’m VERY skeptical that there’s anything to this beyond “the power of positive thinking” (you know, where you THINK they’re working, so that makes you feel confident, which makes those around you pick up on that confidence, etc. – a nice positive feedback loop, but there are cheaper ways to achieve it 😉 ) I’ll report back in a few weeks with more experiments under my belt. ---
**Author:** ![alex398](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/77aa72/32.png) [@alex398](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/alex398)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2011, 7:44pm UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/hello-some-questions-and-some-skepticism/51682/14 "2011-08-12T19:44:29Z")
Dont worry ouro they DO work, get the alpha oil drops, it makes you feel and act like james bond and evryone respects you, trust me you wont regret it! ---
**Author:** ![mobocaster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/c2a13f/32.png) [@mobocaster](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/mobocaster)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2011, 8:59pm UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/hello-some-questions-and-some-skepticism/51682/15 "2011-08-12T20:59:50Z")
If the pheros are not doing anything for you, then I hope you get in touch with either John or Steve to discuss the matter and how you are going about things. And if that still fails, do remember the money back promise. ---
**Author:** ![ouroborous](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/47e85d/32.png) [@ouroborous](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/ouroborous)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2011, 9:02pm UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/hello-some-questions-and-some-skepticism/51682/16 "2011-08-31T21:02:13Z")
Well, I’m sorry to say that after nearly a month of (unscientific) testing, I can detect absolutely zero difference in responses with the [pheromones](https://pheromonelabs.com/shop/). I HAVE noticed that women respond more positively to me when I wear a scent, but it seems to be the same with a pheromone-laced cologne or just a “plain” cologne. I followed all of the tricks in the recommended postings, but I added a “blind” step where I did the non-pheromone tips (“be open to interaction” etc.) without the 'mones as well as with the 'mones – no difference in reaction. Obviously, when I’m more friendly and smile more, I get more “hits,” but that seems to be pretty much the same with or without 'mones; when you act more friendly, confident, and outgoing, people react more positively to you… but the pheromones don’t seem to change that one bit. At least, for me. I’m not looking for money back or anything, I just wanted to post my results, so… thanks for the forum to do so. For me, back to good old fashioned “look nice, smell nice, and act nice” when I want attention from the female half of the population. Ouroborous out!