# How bad is the economy in your country? **URL:** \ **Category:** Lounge\ **Created:** [January 22, 2009, 11:15pm UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/how-bad-is-the-economy-in-your-country/25234 "2009-01-22T23:15:30Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![in\_uk](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/in_uk/32/2130_2.png) [@in\_uk](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/in_uk)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2009, 3:29am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/how-bad-is-the-economy-in-your-country/25234/21 "2009-01-28T03:29:05Z")
The current economic state is going to cost us an absolute fortune in the UK. Check out the exchange rate, an order of [pheromones](https://a314.com/) has almost doubled in price, leaving less cash for phero expeditions. SOMEBODY DO SOMETHING!!! ---
**Author:** ![mark-in-dallas](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/mark-in-dallas/32/860_2.png) [@mark-in-dallas](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/mark-in-dallas)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2009, 4:20am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/how-bad-is-the-economy-in-your-country/25234/22 "2009-01-28T04:20:02Z")
> [@denec](#): > > If companies fail then let them fail, bailing them out will only make it worst later. It already has, they took the money and played with it like they were kids in a candy store! They ran around buying up other banks and insurance companies with the money, buying airplanes, going to lavish spas, and redecorating offices, to the tune of over $1,000,000.00. Yet the auto manufacturers who were only asking to BORROW 1/50 of the money GIVEN to banks, and they employ far more people and do have some integrity, were told to sell their planes, fly commercial airlines and are expected to be almost completely watched over by a committee. A couple of news snippets that pissed me the f%$# off: [http://atsmedia.cachefly.net/images/snippet.png](http://atsmedia.cachefly.net/images/snippet.png) **[www.huffingtonpost.com](http://www.huffingtonpost.com)** ([http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/01/26/citi-jet-purchase-50-mill\_n\_160807.html](http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/01/26/citi-jet-purchase-50-mill_n_160807.html)) The New York Post’s Jennifer Keil and Chuck Bennett reported in Monday’s paper ([http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread431375/pg1](http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread431375/pg1)) that Citigroup, which has received $45 billion in government bailout funds, is about to upgrade to a new $50 million, twelve-seat corporate jet ([http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread431375/pg1](http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread431375/pg1)). The plane, the Dassault Falcon 7X, is a luxurious jet with a range of 5,950 nautical miles (meaning it can fly from New York to all of Europe and South America, as far east as Riyadh, and as far west as Honolulu or Petropavlovsk, Russia). The Post reports it has “plush interior with leather seats, sofas and a customizable entertainment center.” [President Barack Obama bashes financial giants for squandering bailout funds; vows crackdown](http://www.nydailynews.com/news/politics/2009/01/23/2009-01-23_president_barack_obama_bashes_financial_.html) [WASHINGTON](http://www.nydailynews.com/topics/Washington%2c+DC) - [President Obama](http://www.nydailynews.com/topics/Barack+Obama) pushed for more aggressive monitoring of the [Wall Street](http://www.nydailynews.com/topics/Wall+Street) bailout Friday - and he put corporate swashbucklers on notice he’ll crack down on their lavish extravagances. Obama was teed off after hearing reports of companies receiving taxpayer cash, “then going out and renovating bathrooms or offices.” He vented over a “lack of accountability and transparency in how we are managing some of these programs to stabilize the financial system.” One of Wall Street’s biggest power players, [Merrill Lynch CEO John Thain](http://www.nydailynews.com/topics/John+Thain), was abruptly ousted Thursday after it became known he had spent $1 million to decorate his office - including a $1,405 trash can. Obama is working toward comprehensive Wall Street reform and plans to slam the financial sector with tougher regulations to protect retirees and middle class investors. “The American people need to be greatly assured that their hard-earned money is not going to the bonuses or the remodeling of an office at a bank that’s in trouble,” said [White House](http://www.nydailynews.com/topics/The+White+House) spokesman [Robert Gibbs](http://www.nydailynews.com/topics/Robert+Gibbs). “That money needs to go directly to the American people in the form of loans - whether it’s a student loan or an auto loan or [one to] a small business so that it can meet its payroll,” Gibbs added. Obama also has government waste in his cross hairs. “Those all have to be part and parcel of a reform package if we’re going to be responsible in dealing with this economic crisis,” said Obama, issuing his warning as he assembled congressional leaders to work on a new $825 billion economic rescue plan. Democratic lawmakers were confident they can pass a stimulus package by mid-February. “We’re on schedule for our timetable to have a bill on the President’s desk to be signed before the Presidents’ Day recess,” [House Speaker Nancy Pelosi](http://www.nydailynews.com/topics/Nancy+Pelosi) said after the bipartisan summit. Obama hailed both parties’ common goal of staving off a worsening economy. “What I think unifies this group is recognition that we are experiencing an unprecedented, perhaps, economic crisis that has to be dealt with, and dealt with rapidly,” he said. But some Republicans warned against the bill being bloated. “I’m concerned about the size of the package, and I’m concerned about some of the spending that’s in there,” said House GOP leader [John Boehner](http://www.nydailynews.com/topics/John+Boehner). As expected, Obama also signed an executive order lifting a ban on taxpayer funding for groups that perform abortions overseas and counsel women on their reproductive rights. Pro-choice advocates hailed Obama for keeping his campaign pledge to lift the ban, while anti-abortion groups ripped him for allowing taxpayer dollars to fund abortions in other countries. Obama will deliver his State of the Union address to Congress - and a national TV audience - next month. “I don’t believe that we’ve got a date nailed down,” Gibbs said. [kbazinet@nydailynews.com](mailto:kbazinet@nydailynews.com) ---
**Author:** ![mark-in-dallas](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/mark-in-dallas/32/860_2.png) [@mark-in-dallas](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/mark-in-dallas)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2009, 4:21am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/how-bad-is-the-economy-in-your-country/25234/23 "2009-01-28T04:21:07Z")
> [@denec](#): > > If companies fail then let them fail, bailing them out will only make it worst later. It already has, they took the money and played with it like they were kids in a candy store! They ran around buying up other banks and insurance companies with the money, buying airplanes, going to lavish spas, and redecorating offices, to the tune of over $1,000,000.00. Wells Fargo just bought a small chain of banks that I have an account at. It is a smaller regional bank with about 15 branches, and as quickly as I got the notification in the mail, I WENT AND CLOSED THE ACCOUNT!!! Yet the auto manufacturers who were only asking to BORROW 1/50 of the money GIVEN to banks, and they employ far more people and do have some integrity, were told to sell their planes, fly commercial airlines and are expected to be almost completely watched over by a committee. A couple of news snippets that pissed me the f%$# off: [http://atsmedia.cachefly.net/images/snippet.png](http://atsmedia.cachefly.net/images/snippet.png) **[www.huffingtonpost.com](http://www.huffingtonpost.com)** ([http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/01/26/citi-jet-purchase-50-mill\_n\_160807.html](http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/01/26/citi-jet-purchase-50-mill_n_160807.html)) **The New York Post’s Jennifer Keil and Chuck Bennett reported in Monday’s paper that Citigroup, which has received $45 billion in government bailout funds, is about to upgrade to a new $50 million, twelve-seat corporate jet.** The plane, the Dassault Falcon 7X, is a luxurious jet with a range of 5,950 nautical miles (meaning it can fly from New York to all of Europe and South America, as far east as Riyadh, and as far west as Honolulu or Petropavlovsk, Russia). The Post reports it has “plush interior with leather seats, sofas and a customizable entertainment center.” [http://www.nydailynews.com/news/politics/2009/01/23/2009-01-23\_president\_barack\_obama\_bashes\_financial\_.html](http://www.nydailynews.com/news/politics/2009/01/23/2009-01-23_president_barack_obama_bashes_financial_.html) [WASHINGTON](http://www.nydailynews.com/topics/Washington%2c+DC) - [President Obama](http://www.nydailynews.com/topics/Barack+Obama) pushed for more aggressive monitoring of the [Wall Street](http://www.nydailynews.com/topics/Wall+Street) bailout Friday - and he put corporate swashbucklers on notice he’ll crack down on their lavish extravagances. Obama was teed off after hearing reports of companies receiving taxpayer cash, “then going out and renovating bathrooms or offices.” He vented over a “lack of accountability and transparency in how we are managing some of these programs to stabilize the financial system.” **One of Wall Street’s biggest power players, \*\*Merrill Lynch CEO John Thain ([http://www.nydailynews.com/topics/John+Thain](http://www.nydailynews.com/topics/John+Thain))**, was abruptly ousted Thursday after it became known he had spent $1 million to decorate his office - including a $1,405 trash can.\*\* Obama is working toward comprehensive Wall Street reform and plans to slam the financial sector with tougher regulations to protect retirees and middle class investors. “The American people need to be greatly assured that their hard-earned money is not going to the bonuses or the remodeling of an office at a bank that’s in trouble,” said [White House](http://www.nydailynews.com/topics/The+White+House) spokesman [Robert Gibbs](http://www.nydailynews.com/topics/Robert+Gibbs). “That money needs to go directly to the American people in the form of loans - whether it’s a student loan or an auto loan or [one to] a small business so that it can meet its payroll,” Gibbs added. Obama also has government waste in his cross hairs. “Those all have to be part and parcel of a reform package if we’re going to be responsible in dealing with this economic crisis,” said Obama, issuing his warning as he assembled congressional leaders to work on a new $825 billion economic rescue plan. Democratic lawmakers were confident they can pass a stimulus package by mid-February. “We’re on schedule for our timetable to have a bill on the President’s desk to be signed before the Presidents’ Day recess,” [House Speaker Nancy Pelosi](http://www.nydailynews.com/topics/Nancy+Pelosi) said after the bipartisan summit. Obama hailed both parties’ common goal of staving off a worsening economy. “What I think unifies this group is recognition that we are experiencing an unprecedented, perhaps, economic crisis that has to be dealt with, and dealt with rapidly,” he said. But some Republicans warned against the bill being bloated. “I’m concerned about the size of the package, and I’m concerned about some of the spending that’s in there,” said House GOP leader [John Boehner](http://www.nydailynews.com/topics/John+Boehner). As expected, Obama also signed an executive order lifting a ban on taxpayer funding for groups that perform abortions overseas and counsel women on their reproductive rights. Pro-choice advocates hailed Obama for keeping his campaign pledge to lift the ban, while anti-abortion groups ripped him for allowing taxpayer dollars to fund abortions in other countries. Obama will deliver his State of the Union address to Congress - and a national TV audience - next month. “I don’t believe that we’ve got a date nailed down,” Gibbs said. [kbazinet@nydailynews.com](mailto:kbazinet@nydailynews.com) ---
**Author:** ![denec](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/denec/32/1730_2.png) [@denec](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/denec)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2009, 5:50am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/how-bad-is-the-economy-in-your-country/25234/24 "2009-01-28T05:50:32Z")
> [@mark-in-dallas](#): > > As expected, Obama also signed an executive order lifting a ban on taxpayer funding for groups that perform abortions overseas and counsel women on their reproductive rights. > > Pro-choice advocates hailed Obama for keeping his campaign pledge to lift the ban, while anti-abortion groups ripped him for allowing taxpayer dollars to fund abortions in other countries. I did not like obama much before and cannot stand him even now, here we are in a crunch and he is sending money to other countries to help pay for abortions? then you have pelosi talking about giving out condoms to help save the economy. and now obama wants to give more bailouts, it obvious the bailouts did not work the first time what makes him think it will work the second time? first step in fixing the economy is to NOT depend on the government on fixing your problem unfortunately by the time most companies and people figure this out it will be too late ---
**Author:** ![chads](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/2acd7d/32.png) [@chads](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/chads)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2009, 6:59am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/how-bad-is-the-economy-in-your-country/25234/25 "2009-01-28T06:59:14Z")
Yeah and how about funding for the arts as an economic stimulus plan? WTF. Some of this package is just paying back the people who got him there. Politics as usual. Some change. The Citigroup jet was ordered 2 years ago, when times were good. The office redecoration was before the collapse and before any bailout money. These people and companies didn’t get taxpayer money then go out and do this stuff. Not that I’m a bailout fan or anything just pointing out some facts. Chrysler was lent some money in the past and paid it back, so there is a precedent in government loans working to stabilize the automotive industry. However I don’t think that included the government trying to actually RUN the company. Then today Obama put the boots to the automotive industry by allowing California to procede with higher CAFE standards. What a retard. I’m wondering how he will try and buy the unions to make up for this, although auto unions are much smaller now and government employee unions are much larger. I’m not against government help for automotive, on the basis of homeland security. Same for agriculture. World War II showed both of those were necessities. They have to be somewhat competetive though. ---
**Author:** ![Wrlprchnx](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/wrlprchnx/32/1360_2.png) [@Wrlprchnx](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/Wrlprchnx)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2009, 3:29pm UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/how-bad-is-the-economy-in-your-country/25234/26 "2009-01-28T15:29:31Z")
I wouldn’t bitch too much about Wells Fargo The money they received was somewhat automatic - based on their size. Wells Fargo was actually a RESPONSIBLE bank - that’s why they are buying so many little banks up. They didn’t dive head first into this subprimeness and therefore have some additional capital on hand to go buying up the idiots who screwed themselves. Part of the problem with the bailout is that it FORCES Wells Fargo to take the money (even if they don’t really need it). Not taking the money puts them in a hard financial position because all their competitors are getting money. ## Wells Fargo is going to be huge when you guys come out of this recession because they weren’t idiots when times were good (and therefore weren’t caught with their pants down) On another note - the bank just sent me a letter offering me a credit line because the house I took possession of 15 days ago is worth 10% (about 20K) more then what I paid for it. Anybody want to skip recessions? Just come to Manitoba (canada) - Looks like we aren’t having one. ---
**Author:** ![mark-in-dallas](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/mark-in-dallas/32/860_2.png) [@mark-in-dallas](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/mark-in-dallas)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2009, 3:39pm UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/how-bad-is-the-economy-in-your-country/25234/27 "2009-01-28T15:39:38Z")
> [@chads](#): > > Yeah and how about funding for the arts as an economic stimulus plan? WTF. Some of this package is just paying back the people who got him there. Politics as usual. Some change. > > **The Citigroup jet was ordered 2 years ago, when times were good.** > > The office redecoration was before the collapse and before any bailout money. > > These people and companies didn’t get taxpayer money then go out and do this stuff. Not that I’m a bailout fan or anything just pointing out some facts. The writing was on the wall: the sub-prime auto industry had already taken a nose dive and the economy was on a downhill trend. Instead of trying to stabilize losses from sub-prime auto loans gone bad, slow growth and maintain what they had, all they did was substitute one bad loan for another by pushing higher value mortgage loans to people who couldn’t afford them. Then when those loans started going bad too and the money dried up, they started failing and we bailed them out. The banks were in effect building the largest Pansie scheme ever devised, and when they failed as every Pansie scheme has to, it was to the tune of trillions of dollars! Instead of bailing the banks out, we should have prosecuted their board members, let the banks fail and wind up in receivership with the RTC, and dumped the ill gotten gains (bad mortgages) into the hands of the American taxpayers, letting them own their homes outright. Speculative investing is just that, a gamble that money invested will generate a profit. The banks made really bad judgments, and their gambles didn’t pay off. Even I could see that the appreciation in housing values couldn’t last and that they had already spiraled beyond what could be sustained. It was a bubble that had to burst, less we kill the American dream and put home ownership out of reach for the younger and future generations. Nope, I’m sorry but I can’t in any way justify the bailout. I think letting the banks fail, wiping the loans from the books, thus giving the ill gotten assets directly to the American public, and using the $750,000,000,000 to pick up the pieces and re-stabilize America in the aftermath would have been a far better solution. The banking system as it is, and since the conception of the Federal Reserve, doesn’t exist for our benefit, but only to pilfer American wealth and enslave it’s citizens. Our forefathers would turn in their graves if they knew what had been allowed to happen with our monetary system. ---
**Author:** ![chads](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/2acd7d/32.png) [@chads](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/chads)\ **Post date:** [January 29, 2009, 3:40am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/how-bad-is-the-economy-in-your-country/25234/28 "2009-01-29T03:40:58Z")
I agree. I said in my post I am not a bailout fan. These banks would have known things were probably going to crash. I was just pointing out that those articles make it sound like John Fain and Citi got the bailout money and went on spending sprees which isn’t exactly the case. Well , I think bonuses(?!) were paid but the office redecoration and jet weren’t bailout money. Maybe some of the jet was but probably not all of it. ---
**Author:** ![tfrankz](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/tfrankz/32/468_2.png) [@tfrankz](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/tfrankz)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2009, 7:35am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/how-bad-is-the-economy-in-your-country/25234/29 "2009-02-06T07:35:09Z")
Hey this is off subject from what is being said. I have 1-3 people coming and asking for a job daily. I own a pickup and delivery food place, that pays around min. wage, but the drivers make $14-20 an hour. Not bad. Some have said that they got laid off, some are losing there home, even lost there business and home and need a job!! I have alot of kids coming for jobs, not right now. So anyone looking for a job right now, good luck and wish you the best! By the way I have 13 people working for me. Mostly all partime and not hired anyone for 7 months. Not bad for a food place. ---
**Author:** ![PheroQuirk](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/9e8a1a/32.png) [@PheroQuirk](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/PheroQuirk)\ **Post date:** [February 15, 2009, 2:45am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/how-bad-is-the-economy-in-your-country/25234/30 "2009-02-15T02:45:25Z")
Tacitus nailed it right here on this forum - just a couple of weeks after the banking stocks made their all-time high. > [@Our collective economic ass is about to get kicked, hard and rude.](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/our-collective-economic-ass-is-about-to-get-kicked-hard-and-rude/2464): > > this is an excerpt from today’s New York Times… it is what you might call a masterpiece of understatement, if you know what I mean… the backchannel rumors are on the brink of sheer terror.. this is, if you read closely, about the potential collapse of a 6.5 TRILLION dollar market, even a minor downturn in this decade long money machine spells major trouble if they can’t unbreak it quick… everybody’s in denial, and de Nile ain’t just a river in Egypt: "Now, as then, Wall Street firms and entrepr… Here is Lehman brothers for example ![](https://us1.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/uploads/pheromonetalk/original/2X/6/600b0e82515295cc6f4bd188535163ed6274ab3e.jpeg) ---
**Author:** ![Reaper\_vai](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/reaper_vai/32/855_2.png) [@Reaper\_vai](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/Reaper_vai)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2009, 8:58am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/how-bad-is-the-economy-in-your-country/25234/31 "2009-02-19T08:58:45Z")
America’s support of Israel has cost it over $4 Trillion since 1973. Israel still receives over $20 Billion of aid per year which does not include the Iraq and Afghan Wars which the USA is fighting on behalf of the Zionist Regime. Maybe America should take care of it’s own problems before interfering where they are clearly not wanted. ---
**Author:** ![diamond](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/diamond/32/859_2.png) [@diamond](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/diamond)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2009, 10:01am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/how-bad-is-the-economy-in-your-country/25234/32 "2009-02-19T10:01:12Z")
And perhaps we in the UK should stop supplying jets to the Burmese government or the Saudis, who have a worse human rights record than most other middle east states. It wasn’t that long ago that the UK government quietly killed off an investigation into BAE bribing Saudi princes now was it? Seeing as Zimbabwe is a commonwealth country, do you think it’s right that we ignore the situation over there? How about the Russians blackmailing half of Eastern Europe by cutting off their gas supply in mid winter? Of course the majority of the Middle East doesn’t want US support for Israel, just as I’m sure that Israelis aren’t happy with Iranian weapons being smuggled into Gaza through tunnels from Egypt. Equally, I’m not happy about terrorists being trained in Pakistan to blow up buses full of innocent British on the London Streets or attempt to blow up Glasgow Airport with carbombs ---
**Author:** ![Reaper\_vai](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/reaper_vai/32/855_2.png) [@Reaper\_vai](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/Reaper_vai)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2009, 1:38pm UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/how-bad-is-the-economy-in-your-country/25234/33 "2009-02-19T13:38:39Z")
> [@diamond](#): > > And perhaps we in the UK should stop supplying jets to the Burmese government or the Saudis, who have a worse human rights record than most other middle east states. It wasn’t that long ago that the UK government quietly killed off an investigation into BAE bribing Saudi princes now was it? > > Seeing as Zimbabwe is a commonwealth country, do you think it’s right that we ignore the situation over there? How about the Russians blackmailing half of Eastern Europe by cutting off their gas supply in mid winter? > > Of course the majority of the Middle East doesn’t want US support for Israel, just as I’m sure that Israelis aren’t happy with Iranian weapons being smuggled into Gaza through tunnels from Egypt. Equally, I’m not happy about terrorists being trained in Pakistan to blow up buses full of innocent British on the London Streets or attempt to blow up Glasgow Airport with carbombs Saudi’s buy jets and military hardware using their own money. It helps British industry otherwise Britain would lose over 7 Billion every year. With respect to the Israel/Gaza conflict: Israel has multi million dollar hardware supplied by the USA at the expense of the American tax payer, what has America gained? You’re harking about Saudi human rights violations, it was not Saudi jets that pounded innocent civilians and killed 5000 people in 22 days. Nor did the Saudi’s use illegal weapons such as white phosphorus bombs which are banned under the Geneva convention. Israel has had over 131 resolutions passed against it by the U.N. What about Israel’s human rights violations over the past 60 years? No one seems to care about that do they? [List of United Nations resolutions concerning Israel - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_United_Nations_resolutions_concerning_Israel) You’re all to busy groveling and apologizing for the “6 Million” lost during WW2. Palestine has no army to fight Israel. It has no Iranian weapons. Remember Lebanon 2006? That was Iranian fire power. A whole army stopped by less than a thousand men with rocket launchers. And these so called terrorist bases in Pakistan and Afghanistan. It was the USA that set them up to fight the Russians during the cold war. Al Qaeda were our friends then were they not? So was Saddam Hussein. Donald Rumsfield was kissing Saddam’s behind during the 80’s. I could go on but i think you get the jist of it. One more thing, no one likes the Saudi regime and i’m quite looking forward to the day all the Saudi Royals are hanging by the neck from lamp posts. There are no sides, only the truth. ---
**Author:** ![diamond](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/diamond/32/859_2.png) [@diamond](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/diamond)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2009, 1:53pm UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/how-bad-is-the-economy-in-your-country/25234/34 "2009-02-19T13:53:06Z")
I think from your references to Zionist and Palestine that we can see where your political allegiances lie, I am equally sure that you can see where mine are. I think that we should leave it at that before this descends into a slanging match causing one or the both of us to be banned ---
**Author:** ![Reaper\_vai](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/reaper_vai/32/855_2.png) [@Reaper\_vai](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/Reaper_vai)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2009, 2:00pm UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/how-bad-is-the-economy-in-your-country/25234/35 "2009-02-19T14:00:43Z")
> [@diamond](#): > > I think from your references to Zionist and Palestine that we can see where your political allegiances lie, I am equally sure that you can see where mine are. I think that we should leave it at that before this descends into a slanging match causing one or the both of us to be banned I have no political allegiance. Politics is old men talking and young men dying. In regards to Robert Mugabe, we should have executed him a long time ago. Russia? The west tested them in Georgia. The Russians won. Ask yourself this. What has anyone to gain from the suffering of others? ---
**Author:** ![denec](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/denec/32/1730_2.png) [@denec](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/denec)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2009, 4:14pm UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/how-bad-is-the-economy-in-your-country/25234/36 "2009-02-19T16:14:33Z")
> [@Reaper\_vai](#): > > America’s support of Israel has cost it over $4 Trillion since 1973. Israel still receives over $20 Billion of aid per year which does not include the Iraq and Afghan Wars which the USA is fighting on behalf of the Zionist Regime. > > Maybe America should take care of it’s own problems before interfering where they are clearly not wanted. Where do you get your facts from? Iraq and Afghanistan has absolutely nothing to do with Israel, zero, zilch…In fact Israel recommended to Bush back in 2003 they do not invade Iraq for fear it would cause instability in the middle east at the time and btw US has given over 120 billion to the Palestinians this year alone did you know that? but seeing you refer to it as zionist regime i see where you get your prejudices from and the reason why US supports Israel so much is because Israel is the only true democratic ally in the middle east, the only country that does not execute people for being openly gay, the only country in the middle east that does not support terrorism, the only country that supports women rights, the only country that donates so much to charity, the only country that has done so much to better this world. if you look at Israel’s accomplishment in the past 60 years you would be amazed and then compare it to any other country in the middle east, heck for that matter compare it to any other nation in the world while it is constantly under attack from terrorists, with rockets and bombs it is amazing IMO ---
**Author:** ![chads](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/2acd7d/32.png) [@chads](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/chads)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2009, 6:19am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/how-bad-is-the-economy-in-your-country/25234/37 "2009-02-20T06:19:41Z")
Could you cite your sources please? The largest amount I could find was $1.6 trillion since 1973 although I found an amount of $134 billion since 1949, which frankly seems more credible. I suspect if hamas stopped shooting rockets and such into Isreal there wouldn’t be any attacks by Isreal. ---
**Author:** ![Reaper\_vai](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/reaper_vai/32/855_2.png) [@Reaper\_vai](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/Reaper_vai)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2009, 7:15am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/how-bad-is-the-economy-in-your-country/25234/38 "2009-02-20T07:15:47Z")
> [@denec](#): > > Where do you get your facts from? > > Iraq and Afghanistan has absolutely nothing to do with Israel, zero, zilch…In fact Israel recommended to Bush back in 2003 they do not invade Iraq for fear it would cause instability in the middle east at the time > > and btw US has given over 120 billion to the Palestinians this year alone did you know that? > > but seeing you refer to it as zionist regime i see where you get your prejudices from > > and the reason why US supports Israel so much is because Israel is the only true democratic ally in the middle east, the only country that does not execute people for being openly gay, the only country in the middle east that does not support terrorism, the only country that supports women rights, the only country that donates so much to charity, the only country that has done so much to better this world. > > if you look at Israel’s accomplishment in the past 60 years you would be amazed and then compare it to any other country in the middle east, heck for that matter compare it to any other nation in the world while it is constantly under attack from terrorists, with rockets and bombs it is amazing IMO What has Israel done to better the world? Name one thing. $120 billion to Palestine this year? They don’t want your money. Just open the border crossings, retreat to 1967 borders and stop arresting 12 year old children and charging them with terrorism. If left alone Palestine would become the french riviera of the middle east. Israel demolished The airport in Gaza right after it was built, why so? Oh wealthy Arabs might go there and start spending some of their billions. Western companies might set up interests which would make it very difficult for Israel to murder people. The reason the USA support Israel is because they want instability in the regime. Americans should remember the USS Liberty Memorial. [USS Liberty Memorial](http://www.gtr5.com/) Terrorism? Under British law Israel _IS_ a terrorist state. The mandate for Palestine still belongs to the British. Also If Israel is so amazing then why has the UN passed over 131 Resolutions against it? [List of United Nations resolutions concerning Israel - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_United_Nations_resolutions_concerning_Israel) Almost forgot to mention the Extremist government that has now been elected in Israel. Tzipi Livni doesn’t seem to like it. [Bloomberg.com: Worldwide](http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601087&sid=aDt0cXGmDEfc&refer=home) Also like to pint out that that several Aid agencies around the world are going to have Israel bought up on war crimes. Four of them have already been heard at the UN. And what is the Motto of Mossad? ‘By Way of Deception, thou shalt do War’ [Mossad - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mossad) ---
**Author:** ![Tigerlilly](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/tigerlilly/32/2257_2.png) [@Tigerlilly](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/Tigerlilly)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2009, 10:11am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/how-bad-is-the-economy-in-your-country/25234/39 "2009-02-20T10:11:00Z")
By the simple fact alone that you are using Wikipedia to support yourself and your “facts”, you should be laughed off this forum. Spout your dogma elsewhere. Take your UN love affair elsewhere. You hijacked this thread long enough. ---
**Author:** ![overlord](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/overlord/32/2387_2.png) [@overlord](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/overlord)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2009, 12:24pm UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/how-bad-is-the-economy-in-your-country/25234/40 "2009-02-20T12:24:25Z")
Well here in the Netherlands it’s not very good either, the major factory’s and the large banks are laying off alot of people. I must say on the other hand alot of people I know aren’t affected very much by it. other then their stocks dropped. especially in the city where I live life just goes on. About 70% of the inhabitants are students who study here, since schollarships are unaffected economy locally is pretty much the same. [Previous page](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/how-bad-is-the-economy-in-your-country/25234.md?page=1) [Next page](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/how-bad-is-the-economy-in-your-country/25234.md?page=3)