# I have a relationship question for the ladies **URL:** \ **Category:** Women's Pheromone Advice & Field Reports\ **Created:** [August 16, 2010, 11:15pm UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/i-have-a-relationship-question-for-the-ladies/40854 "2010-08-16T23:15:13Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 14\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![thegentleman](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/thegentleman/32/1770_2.png) [@thegentleman](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/thegentleman)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2010, 11:15pm UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/i-have-a-relationship-question-for-the-ladies/40854/1 "2010-08-16T23:15:13Z")
Me and my girl have had some rocky times in the past, but usually we make up rather quickly. About 3-4 weeks ago, we had another pretty good falling out. She says she still loves me, but doesn’t know if she can forgive me, and she does not trust me. During our argument, it got ugly and we both said a few rather hurtful things to each other. I apologized which she accepted, but as she said she doesn’t know if she forgives me. She hasn’t apologized, but I have already told her that I know she didn’t mean the things she said, that she was upset, and words quite honestly don’t bother me. When people say things to me in the heat of anger, I know that’s a huge part of it, they’re just hurt and want to hurt back. So here’s the issue: About a week and a half ago, she went back to acting as if everything was normal. Conversations at work were normal, the fun flirting, teasing etc we do was all going on. I was not making any attempts at approaching her, she was coming to me often, even after her shift she would come talk to me, and I could see she was not wanting to leave, but I had to work so she had to. In another situation, she kinda followed me around while still on lunch and I was on break. Normally she’d finish her lunch getting in a quick smoke before going back to work, but instead she just followed me around. The next day, I actually took her in my arms and she put her head on my shoulder as I hugged her. That’s when she told me she still loved me, but didn’t know if she could forgive me. Outside of work, I was also giving her some space, letting her make any attempts at talking to me. This was still really soon after our argument, so there wasn’t much going on in conversing outside of work. She’s moving in December out of state for school. We had planned on moving in together in the past, but have since changed our minds on that. There has been discussion on my relocating too, I had planned on moving to San Francisco this fall before I even met her, and she is going to Santa Cruz. So even if I moved to San Fran, we’d be under 2 hours from each other. We had a talk the other night and we were discussing our future when she said she didn’t know if she wanted to handle me. I told her that we had such a short amount of time together, that I wasn’t just going to sit around and wait. I brought up how she had been acting, following me around, coming to talk to me etc. Her response was, that she was just treating me like anyone else at work she didn’t hate, that she wasn’t trying to bring me back into her life, because that’s what she did NOT want. She was done with me, but just hadn’t had the heart to tell me. So I told her then it would be best that at work, she kept her distance, and our discussions remain purely work related. While we work in the same building, she is in a different department, so we’re not right next to each other all day. Her response was that she wasn’t going to make it easy on me. Anyway, I know this girl really well. While she may have said this stuff in this moment, she would not necessarily mean it in the next. I asked her if something were going on, and yeah she was bothered by something in her life, but she just didn’t feel up to talk to me about it. This girl is very special to me. I’m not perfect, neither is she. But I don’t want my ego to get in the way and not reach out to her if that is what she’s really wanting from me. Since that conversation she was on vacation, but was back at work yesterday. I had to ask her a quick question, she was playful once again. I was working with one guy yesterday who before we had this disagreement she talked to him, but didn’t make it a point to stop by every passing to speak to him, but now does. He’s gay, so he’s not competition. But she’s making sure to make her presence known. I also still catch her eying me from afar. This is not just wishful thinking, two guys I work with both noticed it was she who was always coming by to talk to me, and then at work yesterday another guy started laughing and I asked him what he was laughing about, and he was like…"Your girl man, she comes walking by and it’s like, ‘notice me.’ " When we first got together we broke things off about 3 months into it. But, if I had not reached out and talk to her, I wouldn’t have found out she was just trying to figure out whether or not she really loved me, and came to the conclusion that she did. She is very strong willed, and if she’s wanting me back into her life, she won’t say anything unless she reaches some point of desperation. I will have to make most of the effort to find out. So my question are these: 1. Being that she said she is done, do I just continue to act as if we are completely done and move on? 2. Is her continuing proximity a sign that she’s not truly done, but wants me to initiate, but maybe take things real slow to build up her trust again? 3. Do I just call her / text her and tell her that I still love her and miss her? 4. Do I just break through this wall she’s built up, take her in my arms and tell her how much I love her and I am not going to leave her, that I’m going to fight for her? Thanks in advance ladies… ---
**Author:** ![Nicoli](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/919ad9/32.png) [@Nicoli](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/Nicoli)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2010, 1:57am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/i-have-a-relationship-question-for-the-ladies/40854/2 "2010-08-17T01:57:00Z")
10 views- 0 answers. We don’t know, sorry. ---
**Author:** ![P51Mustang](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/p51mustang/32/1266_2.png) [@P51Mustang](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/P51Mustang)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2010, 5:19am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/i-have-a-relationship-question-for-the-ladies/40854/3 "2010-08-17T05:19:15Z")
> [@Nicoli](#): > > 10 views- 0 answers. > We don’t know, sorry. A little pre-mature don’t you think? ---
**Author:** ![Scipio](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/3ec8ea/32.png) [@Scipio](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/Scipio)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2010, 8:45am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/i-have-a-relationship-question-for-the-ladies/40854/4 "2010-08-17T08:45:48Z")
> [@P51Mustang](#): > > A little pre-mature don’t you think? quite. I’d let this float around for a day or two. Also good to hear things from both genders ---
**Author:** ![thegentleman](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/thegentleman/32/1770_2.png) [@thegentleman](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/thegentleman)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2010, 10:42am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/i-have-a-relationship-question-for-the-ladies/40854/5 "2010-08-17T10:42:21Z")
> [@Scipio](#): > > quite. > > I’d let this float around for a day or two. > > Also good to hear things from both genders Yeah, I was really wanting to hear a lady’s perspective on things. I knew the guys would be saying…“NO DON’T TEXT HER!” LOL, that was a given. ---
**Author:** ![tisha23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/53a042/32.png) [@tisha23](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/tisha23)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2010, 12:08pm UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/i-have-a-relationship-question-for-the-ladies/40854/6 "2010-08-17T12:08:02Z")
Actually Nicole is right to some extent. We can tell you what we think and feel but not what to do. You will get a lot of different views but we are not you or your GF so ultimately you have to do whats right for the both of you. > [@](#): > > 1. Being that she said she is done, do I just continue to act as if we are completely done and move on? That depends on whether you truly believe she is done. Are you done ? Obviously not or you would not be asking. > [@](#): > > 1. Is her continuing proximity a sign that she’s not truly done, but wants me to initiate, but maybe take things real slow to build up her trust again? Her continuing proximity is because you work in the same proximity. Her continuing attention however indicates she still has feelings for you. However just because she has feelings and expresses them doesn’t mean she wants to have a relationship with you. You dont stop loving people just because you cant build a relationship. Love is the ground we build relationships on once its there, its there whether you build on it or not. > [@](#): > > 1. Do I just call her / text her and tell her that I still love her and miss her? You cant build anything with her if you dont interact with her and you told her to not interact with you at work unless its work related. That’s the wall you built not her. Seems she is complying with your request to some extent so the ball is now in your court. > [@](#): > > 1. Do I just break through this wall she’s built up. I am unsure of this question. What wall has she built ? I am not sure as to why she says she doesn’t trust you. Either she has trust issues on a whole which would be a wall she built or something occurred to make her trust waiver. If its the first thing then she has to work on that wall herself and all you can do is be trustworthy so she sees there is no need for a wall. If you did something to make her trust waiver thats not a wall. It just means its something you both need to work on in the foundation of your relationship. It has to be done before you can move forward in the relationship because you need a strong foundation to be able to build on. That cant be done if you dont interact and that is the wall you built. Sure she is jumping up and down looking over the wall hoping to get your attention but the choice to take it down and try to build something better is yours. That’s why your friend at work is laughing. Both of you are jumping up and down to look over the wall but neither of you will jump over. Sure if you jump it may hurt, then again it may be great, but you will never know unless you jump. > [@](#): > > take her in my arms and tell her how much I love her and I am not going to leave her, that I’m going to fight for her? I wouldn’t go all wishy washy and declare your undying devotion or anything. You dont want to jump over and lay down and wallow. No women wants to build a relationship with the guy who lays down. Just start interacting again and building a wall of trust you can both stand on the same side of. Let her know you want to build a relationship but you have to do it together. Take the time needed to build a strong foundation. That may mean stepping back into a earlier stage of your relationship. Your gonna get different views especially from the PUA community. I have absolutely nothing against PUA tactics. They are great for dealing with the insecurities, ego’s and fears some people have. They set boundaries and establish positions that is common practice in the beginning stages of attraction and relationships. Its fine for playing or casual relationships. But when love comes into the picture there is no more room for the fears of our egos. You mentioned she loves you and you love her. I am not trying to be rude but do you know what that is ? Seriously this is a question I ask my sons when they start acting stupid over a girl. (not saying your acting stupid) Its seeing someone for who they truly are and not what we want them to be and to want the highest good for that person regardless of our own self interest. It requires a risk. Every true emotion does. Because joy can not exist without pain. Laughter can not exist without tears and Love can not exist without fear. So there is just one question really. Are you brave enough to take the risk regardless of the outcome ? Remember though before you answer this question. If you dont take the risk then you cant find love. Thats why we cant tell you what to do. Only you know what your willing to risk. Tisha ---
**Author:** ![thegentleman](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/thegentleman/32/1770_2.png) [@thegentleman](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/thegentleman)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2010, 12:55pm UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/i-have-a-relationship-question-for-the-ladies/40854/7 "2010-08-17T12:55:33Z")
Thanks Tisha, this is exactly what I was expecting from a woman of confidence…which is why I love my girl. Strong, confident women don’t play around, they find the holes in what you’re saying and point them out. You bring up some very valid points here and I’ll address the more important issues real quickly: - No I am personally not done. But I of course don’t want to walk around like a lost, love sick puppy, acting pathetic, clingy and needy. - The proximity issue, we work in the same building, but she has made efforts to be near me. There is the passing by, but she has gone out of her way in many instances. But I do agree with your comment that it could be that she still has feelings, but doesn’t want to build a relationship. - As far as me limiting our conversation. Once again you are right, that is the wall I built up. It was in response to her saying that she was done and I was confusing her behavior of being polite with her wanting more. So, I figured to avoid any confusion in the future, it would be best if we just stuck to “professional” conduct. But yeah, that does make it difficult to work on building that trust if we don’t interact. The ball is definitely in my court, I will have to be a bit more open. - Now the wall I was referring to, is her protecting herself from getting hurt again. Where she feels as though she can’t trust me, involves an issue where I feel I can’t trust her. What set off this last argument is pretty much my only pet peeve with her, she can be inconsiderate. We were to have lunch, instead she went out with friends all night, got herself sick, called off at work, but didn’t inform me. I had to take care of a bunch of biz in order to make lunch happen for the two of us only to show up and she’s not there. This was the 2nd time a similar thing happened that week. I was upset, told her it was the last time she pulled something like that. Well, needless to say, we got into a heated argument and we both said things we regret. Not trying to make myself look innocent here, but I said two things I shouldn’t have said that were just spiteful. One was “There’s a reason guys have always left you, and will continue to do so.” She on the other hand, said a ton of stuff, but shit like that just doesn’t bother me, because I know it was said out of hurt and anger. This is where the trust comes in. She said she doesn’t trust that I love her. - As far as knowing what love is, yeah I know. I have fallen in love with her warts and all. That isn’t to say I accept bad behavior etc. But I look at the overall picture that she creates as a person and accept her for who she is now. Sure there are some things I wish she would change, and God knows I work so hard at trying to accept those she won’t. But I also know there are things about me she wishes I would change, but still loved me regardless. More than taking her in my arms and telling her how much I love her, I wanna just grab her by the shoulders and shake her like I’m waking her up and tell her that we’re both acting incredibly stupid right now. For now, I’m going to at least open the door at work, enough so if she wants me to advance any more, it gives her enough wiggle room to show me without fear of losing face. Thanks for the response Tisha. ---
**Author:** ![Mongo](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/mongo/32/2034_2.png) [@Mongo](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/Mongo)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2010, 1:07pm UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/i-have-a-relationship-question-for-the-ladies/40854/8 "2010-08-17T13:07:26Z")
This seems to really revolve around that argument and what was said, it might not sit well to be honest on here but you typed alot bit skirted around this subject, it’s something you should possibly come out with to get the best and most sound advice (most assuredly not from me btw). Not like we are going to find out who you are from it … unless your bob from accounting downstairs… ---
**Author:** ![yetis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/59ef9b/32.png) [@yetis](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/yetis)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2010, 12:24am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/i-have-a-relationship-question-for-the-ladies/40854/9 "2010-08-18T00:24:36Z")
Just my 2 cents… Women are like cats. If you follow and want to catch them they’ll run away. If you ignore them they’ll follow you, want to cuddle, or to catch your attention ([still] attractive enough?), they want to have what’s out of their reach, etc. In my eyes it seems that she feels safe, if she’s around or with you @ work, 'cause of the strong bonding of your past relationship with her. You might be her property (unconsciousness feeling in her), so she checks out that you don’t have any relationships with other women at work, and/or she wants to see (better word is feel), if you still have “real” feelings for her, and if you are the man that you were before. She may check out, if you have changed in your own personality, and wants to get a clue what it is, or you slipped into the “be friends”-category!? Look at her and your bodylanguage, when you interact with her. This can tell you more than words can say… Maybe she wants you to grap the steering wheel and lead the relationship onto a higher level. It’s possible that an “actiondate” can help to glaze some cracks… To have fun and action can melt the grown iceberg between you and her away… She’s always around you? Then do something unexpected “funny” with her, when nobody else is near… dominance, action and fun… 😉 cul8er. ---
**Author:** ![thegentleman](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/thegentleman/32/1770_2.png) [@thegentleman](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/thegentleman)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2010, 1:05am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/i-have-a-relationship-question-for-the-ladies/40854/10 "2010-08-18T01:05:40Z")
> [@yetis](#): > > Just my 2 cents… > > Women are like cats. If you follow and want to catch them they’ll run away. If you ignore them they’ll follow you, want to cuddle, or to catch your attention ([still] attractive enough?), they want to have what’s out of their reach, etc. > > In my eyes it seems that she feels safe, if she’s around or with you @ work, 'cause of the strong bonding of your past relationship with her. You might be her property (unconsciousness feeling in her), so she checks out that you don’t have any relationships with other women at work, and/or she wants to see (better word is feel), if you still have “real” feelings for her, and if you are the man that you were before. She may check out, if you have changed in your own personality, and wants to get a clue what it is, or you slipped into the “be friends”-category!? Look at her and your bodylanguage, when you interact with her. This can tell you more than words can say… > Maybe she wants you to grap the steering wheel and lead the relationship onto a higher level. It’s possible that an “actiondate” can help to glaze some cracks… To have fun and action can melt the grown iceberg between you and her away… > > She’s always around you? Then do something unexpected “funny” with her, when nobody else is near… dominance, action and fun… 😉 > > cul8er. Some very good points here…thx! Just some more info here, because you brought up the body language thing. I have studied body language for quite sometime now, but just now am getting into NLP. I ride a bike, she got a cute little scooter recently. So when I thought we were on the mend, she comes “roaring” up on it, and we had a good time talking about it, lots of laughing and bonding over the names she had given my bike, and now hers. Anyway, I say to her, “we need to go riding together now.” I saw an interesting mixture of body language, real inconsistent and the read I got was she’s just confused about what she wants. 1. She looked down immediately and gave a forced chuckle. _Not good._ 2. But instead of nodding her head no, when sort of agreeing with me, she nodded her head yes. _possibly good sign_ People will often say yes to something, while nodding their head no. I may be reaching here, but I know this girl really well. There were times when she said things like…“It’s scary, it’s like you’re in my head or something.” Simple fact is, unbeknown to her, I used her to study while learning things like body language, and some speed seduction techniques as well as some basic NLP stuff when I sort of delved into it. So I’ve got a real good baseline on how she operates. But, I also know if I push too hard, she’ll run and go into defensive mode. I do have to play hard to get for awhile to soften her up, and get her to “miss” me. I brought this all up for a variety of reasons. I wanted some input from this community from both sexes, and to sort of keep my head out of the clouds and keep reaching for something that is not there…a reality check so to speak. I don’t talk to our friends about it, as I don’t want to put them in a precarious spot to “choose,” and I don’t wanna be that guy who pines about a girl all day long. I did enough of that when I first met her…LOL…even I got sick of me. To get back to the trust issue, and grabbing that steering wheel. I know she wants more out of me when it comes to inner strength, and being that man who _even tho’ she won’t admit it_ can take care of her. And I have failed her at times. I know there are other women out there, but it bothers me that I hurt someone so bad, especially someone who I adored, and even tho’ she questions it now, she knew it. About a month ago, when having one of those conversations about “us.” She told me how she is so comfortable with her self, her body, and has so much more confidence because I instilled those beliefs in her by believing in her. I’d hate to know I have undone any of that. I’ve decided that I’m going to open that door and let her in, and give her the opportunity to let me know when it’s safe to approach her. Right now she can’t even do that because I closed the door completely. I’m still not texting or calling her, only because I know that can come across as desperate. I guess what I’m wanting to accomplish here is allowing her to reopen the contact in a face saving way. Not that she was wrong, but she is hard headed, and if it makes her look weak, she’s not gonna do it. ---
**Author:** ![yetis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/59ef9b/32.png) [@yetis](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/yetis)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2010, 4:06am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/i-have-a-relationship-question-for-the-ladies/40854/11 "2010-08-18T04:06:37Z")
Sounds a little bit similar to what i have experienced in the past two years when i met my real soulmate. She pushed me into big trouble, and i made so many mistakes while i was in love (oneitis you know?!)… I’ve drawn the line and stopped to contact her, 'cause i think that she’s only playing with my heart… As she benefited from our relationship, I was good for her and she was friendly to me. Now she doesn’t need me anymore ignoring me. In the meanwhile i started new hobbies like PUA-stuff, NLP and [pheromones](https://pheromonelabs.com/), and going to write an article about pheros in the near future, but i have to test them. In September i have the possibility to test the next three years during schooltime to get my A-Level. Back to you and the bodylanguage thing: Your girlfriend wants security and freedom, but both things don’t fit. More security = lesser freedom and vice versa. That’s maybe the question in her mind. Find the golden middle way… ---
**Author:** ![thegentleman](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/thegentleman/32/1770_2.png) [@thegentleman](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/thegentleman)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2010, 5:06am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/i-have-a-relationship-question-for-the-ladies/40854/12 "2010-08-18T05:06:54Z")
> [@yetis](#): > > Sounds a little bit similar to what i have experienced in the past two years when i met my real soulmate. She pushed me into big trouble, and i made so many mistakes while i was in love (oneitis you know?!)… I’ve drawn the line and stopped to contact her, 'cause i think that she’s only playing with my heart… > As she benefited from our relationship, I was good for her and she was friendly to me. Now she doesn’t need me anymore ignoring me. In the meanwhile i started new hobbies like PUA-stuff, NLP and pheromones, and going to write an article about pheros in the near future, but i have to test them. In September i have the possibility to test the next three years during schooltime to get my A-Level. > > Back to you and the bodylanguage thing: > Your girlfriend wants security and freedom, but both things don’t fit. More security = lesser freedom and vice versa. That’s maybe the question in her mind. Find the golden middle way… Thanks for all the input. I’m sorry you and your girl couldn’t find your own middle ground. As far as school is going, and your hobbies, good onya! I’m looking forward to following your progress here. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![fishdude](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/4bbf92/32.png) [@fishdude](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/fishdude)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2010, 7:52pm UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/i-have-a-relationship-question-for-the-ladies/40854/13 "2010-08-18T19:52:34Z")
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**Author:** ![Cindy11](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/439d5e/32.png) [@Cindy11](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/Cindy11)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2010, 12:50pm UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/i-have-a-relationship-question-for-the-ladies/40854/14 "2010-08-19T12:50:48Z")
Some really good points here. I agree that your girlfriend wants security and freedom when she’s in a relationship with you. Both of you need some space apart to figure out whether you want to go forward with the relationship, but that’s really hard to do since you see each other at work. Telling her to keep things professional at work was the right thing to do. From what you’re saying, it does sound like she’s keeping it professional. You will still see indications of interest in her body language that are different from what she’s telling you because the feelings don’t end when the relationship does. Only one way to find out what she really wants and that is to give her a chance to talk to you. You could invite her out to lunch to talk about the relationship. If she won’t see you, or if she does see you but is still unwilling to open up to you during that time, it’s because the relationship really is over. Then you will know and can move on.