I noticed from both that they seemed to help me bond with women in particular (I try to be scientific but truthfully I don’t care too much what men think). In a romantic sense, especially if used together I noticed it helped to drive things forward when I used it with TUTH and yeah, it was nice. I also used them in this pherobomb from a while back. Meo-Est, P80, P83, P93, P95, P96, P97, P102, P103
To be honest, if all these ingredients were available (and I could afford them) I’d composite that in a heartbeat.
Sorry to derail your thread, Andrew!