# pheromone-induced arousal and 2nd date-itis **URL:** \ **Category:** Men's Pheromone Advice & Field Reports\ **Created:** [April 19, 2009, 4:24pm UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/pheromone-induced-arousal-and-2nd-date-itis/28202 "2009-04-19T16:24:59Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 12\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![mahalo\_silver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/8dc957/32.png) [@mahalo\_silver](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/mahalo_silver)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2009, 4:24pm UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/pheromone-induced-arousal-and-2nd-date-itis/28202/1 "2009-04-19T16:24:59Z")
So i’ve been contemplating what has beome a regular Mahalo phenomena in recent times, or as i now refer to it, the female pheromone response that generally results in “2nd date-itis”. How can i have such tremendous experiences with girls on first dates when wearing an intelligent pheromone mix, only to have the girl flake on me for subsequent dates;? or, “how can a girl who seems to be having such a great time with me, is so aroused by the experience, feels very comfortable with my kisses, and is generally enjoying the whole landscape of Mahalo’s seduction, now be flakey and not want another date?”… I have refined my mixes with all recent knowledge. for eg. 1.p83 works much better when combined with Androstenone and viser versa. 2.TAH and p86 r the 2 additives that will really make the girls comfortable with acting on a -none arousal. 3.recent killer mixes have included - tuh or Ammo, p86, p83, TAH and IS IS is important as it generally locks in and “brings out” the best qualities of p86, p83 and TAH. 4. TAH works optimally between 5mcg and 10mcg for males and must be worn with Androstenone for male/female pheromone balance. It is definately the key to my improved pheromone experiences with women. It is the TAH that makes them act and feel comfortable with there arousal, not TAL. Anyways, to get back to the title of this topic, what r some possible explanations for girls who seem generally aroused, have great 1st date or club experiences with me, cause them to suddenly flake or lose interest? Are these classic dating issues or mistakes, or pheromone-induced response/ behavioral patterns?, or, as i suspect, a combination of both. Possible explanations/ rationalisations: 1.These r girls i have kissed on dates, but maybe they r dissapointed that i didnt try to get them into bed that night? i thought girls respect guys who dont try to get them into bed on the 1st date? 2. Fear of attachment - a compliment really. like she is telling me she had suuch a good time, she dosent want to see me again as shes scared she’ll get hurt? or the [pheromones](https://pheromonelabs.com/) did such a good job that she now dosen’t feel worthy? The girl later told me via a text: “i had such a great night with u, but i leave in April so dont want to get attached”. 3. The date i had last week. Lovely dinner. had 2 TAH sprays added an hour in [taking the total TAH to 10mcg for the night], and she became very forward with arousal. I truly thought i was gonna get laid. The bill came, and as is custom in these parts, i split the bill 50/50. She totally turned - deal breaker. Havent seen her since. This could just be a money issue, or a pheromone induced “buyers remorse” issue… 4. TAH and TUH and p83 were the key themes of a great sexy night i had with 2 Asian girls in a club. Yet they r best friends. With TAH on, they were both competing for my attention and flirtations. Haven’t heard from them since. 5.They wake up the next morning and they can’t rationalise the attraction any more. they can’t understand y they were so aroused by u, and may feel cheated, tricked or harbour a resentment towards u. Ie., they feel “played”. 6. The classic “buyers remorse” scenario, whereby the seduction was incongruent, a common malady with pheremone enhanced seduction. she asks herself: “Is this normally the sort of guy I’d go for?”… 7. I can also backwards rationalise, “is this the sorta girl i’d normally be attracted to, or r the pheromones doing an unusually good job in what would otherwise be a non-attraction?”. These 2 scenarios r likely to cause “buyers remorse”. Pheromones come into there own and r of most value with a girl u already have a nice chemistry with… So yes, points 6 and 7 r generally solid reasons for 2nd-date, pheromone induced -itis. But im wondering if its more than that, for many of my dating experiences with pheromones hAVE been with girls i have a chemistry with. I can also take it as a compliment that a girl has snubbed me after an amazing 1st date. 1. They like u so much now, that they expect more of u, they want u to chase abit more, pursue more, woo, seduce. They like u alot so now make 'em feel special. Me? My follow up for a 2nd date has been a text message. Asking em out on sms’s as im too lazy or poor to keep calling on a mobile…Maybe this is my problem? Text messages dont exactly make the girl feel special…But i still dont see y this matters to the point where theyd start flaking… What is the female perspective on this? So, the summary core of this whole flaking thing after amazing 1st date experiences has been wearing pheromones. Catch 22, as i seriously doubt i would have has the “amazing 1st date” without the pheromone mix on. What to do, what to do…what r the collective thoughts of the pheromone gurus? ---
**Author:** ![Gone\_with\_the\_Wind](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/gone_with_the_wind/32/2227_2.png) [@Gone\_with\_the\_Wind](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/Gone_with_the_Wind)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2009, 5:07pm UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/pheromone-induced-arousal-and-2nd-date-itis/28202/2 "2009-04-19T17:07:04Z")
A couple of thoughts. 1 - If you’re going with a anone base then don’t stop and leave them hanging, unless you get a strong cue to do so. 2 - You might try adding rone into the mix if you want to take things more slowly and with more of a LTR focus. ---
**Author:** ![yogalefty](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/a9a28c/32.png) [@yogalefty](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/yogalefty)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2009, 6:11pm UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/pheromone-induced-arousal-and-2nd-date-itis/28202/3 "2009-04-19T18:11:48Z")
[P74](https://a314.com/product/p74/) has been said to negate some feelings of buyers remorse… I have had better experiences with girls at parties (james bond, suave guy vibe) when I wore the p74 along with some androsterone and none. Still I learned a ton from reading this. Good luck with keeping the girls though. If a girl really matters to you and you had a good first date with her you should be showing her interest and pursuing her so that she does feel special. Just my opinion. ---
**Author:** ![Gegogi](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/gegogi/32/1536_2.png) [@Gegogi](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/Gegogi)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2009, 6:24pm UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/pheromone-induced-arousal-and-2nd-date-itis/28202/4 "2009-04-19T18:24:15Z")
Yep, “2nd date-itis” is common but there isn’t much you can do about it. She was digging you and enjoying every moment and, poof, she’s gone. In fact, as a guy, I’ve been guilty of the same flaky behavior. Why? You get home and think about it. Although you liked them, had a good time, they didn’t fit your profile of the ideal lover. Maybe you fit 75% of what she wants in a man but aren’t rich enough, or dress strange, don’t have the right friends, listen to incompatible music, go to the wrong church, smoke, eat only organic, etc. These “lifestyle” things may not matter to you, but they matter a lot to other people. Or maybe she was into you, wants to have fun but doesn’t want to get involved in a serious relationship as grad school is a priority. The list goes on. ---
**Author:** ![jessejester](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/jessejester/32/1683_2.png) [@jessejester](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/jessejester)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2009, 7:12pm UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/pheromone-induced-arousal-and-2nd-date-itis/28202/5 "2009-04-19T19:12:36Z")
Is it possible (just throwing it out there) that the first date goes so far into seduction, (mentally or physicaly)that they could feel that if another date happens the only thing that is left to do is have sex? And confronted with that fact, they realize they are not ready for it? ---
**Author:** ![JohnnyPaper](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/johnnypaper/32/338_2.png) [@JohnnyPaper](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/JohnnyPaper)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2009, 2:01am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/pheromone-induced-arousal-and-2nd-date-itis/28202/6 "2009-04-20T02:01:28Z")
> [@jessejester](#): > > Is it possible (just throwing it out there) that the first date goes so far into seduction, (mentally or physicaly)that they could feel that if another date happens the only thing that is left to do is have sex? And confronted with that fact, they realize they are not ready for it? Shit yeah…if you meet a chick that believes she has seen just about every personality and attitude etc etc. men have to offer and then for some reason becomes enamored with you for some damn reason and can’t figure out why…they can definitely become one of 2 things…either sketched out or extremely stalkerish! In my experience if women can’t attach their emotions to a feeling they are more likely to throw it in the anomaly category and not return to it, that is unless they are very curious and want to find out. -JP 🆒 ---
**Author:** ![djandarial](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/djandarial/32/1667_2.png) [@djandarial](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/djandarial)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2009, 2:42am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/pheromone-induced-arousal-and-2nd-date-itis/28202/7 "2009-04-20T02:42:40Z")
I agree this can happen I think some of you are taking too direct an approach. I with these have resorted to, I know they are interested, whether phero related or not, don’t come on strong, entice. At which point, go casual, The buyer remorse is by taking things too fast and the girls get wigged out. Easy peesy. I call this “Reverse Game Pawn Maneuver”…I’ve invented a maneuver… I don’t know if this is from some book, I am only reading the game at the moment about 200 pages in… Here is what I have started to change my game into: Girl was obviously interested, she opened me, after about 2 eye contact “moments”. Asked my name, hair play, kinda glazed look. night continues, she talks to other people dancing with other people. I approach her friend, talk to her, ask if she is “a good girl” because I am interested.. “I don’t want some wild girl” DHV They “the friend” usually respond with the, my friend is nice, yadda, good girl, and ask how I know they are interested. I say I saw it in her eyes, she seems very nice, and that there _this is where I kill the “why did I feel attracted to someone I am not normally attracted to bit”_ I kinda act like I am thinking hard… and say “I don’t know… why… I just feel attracted to her… I can’t explain it.. perhaps it was when we were dancing, or how her eyes sparkled… I don’t know… it’s weird… I can’t really explain it.. but I know I feel it.” She tells me… you have to go after what you want,(the friend was feeling the mix too) _Because she was talking to other people and dancing, I later took her friend aside and said this since her friend the one I was interested in was talking to someone else… and obviously not into him, body away, foot tapping…stalling for me to make a move.._ "hey, I tried to talk to her, but she was talking to that guy and he would not let me get a word in, since it is their party and i am a guest, I did not want to make a scene, (I reinforce) Is she even interested in that guy? she seems distant to him and her foot is tapping like she wants to get away…(she says I see what you mean) I just want to let you know, even though I am not approaching her, if she says something to you… let her know I am interested, she seems like the only “real girl” I’ve met in a long time. (she has her shit together) & that we have a mutual friend so I see her around some time (the friend gives me an exact place and time to see them both…in a way that said…she is interested…and that is so damned genuine to actually show respect when you already know she would go home with you..she hinted) I hope this is not too much.. but It is about not always direct confrontation, but getting the “fact” that obviously both parties feel something real, that same “why do I feel so strongly, I have no clue” train of thought. Reinforces the “im not here just to find a lay”, and still makes it “ok” and “must not just be a in the moment feeling one time”. I met her once for like 5 minutes, about 2 weeks ago, she reacted to another mix, felt attraction then IOI with hair play, and when I told her we had met, she made that association of how she felt then, and how she felt now, and made it stronger… I believe. This is theory, but I’ll report on the process and if it works, I’ll see her wednesday if not sooner. ---
**Author:** ![mahalo\_silver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/8dc957/32.png) [@mahalo\_silver](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/mahalo_silver)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2009, 10:33am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/pheromone-induced-arousal-and-2nd-date-itis/28202/8 "2009-04-20T10:33:12Z")
Thanks guys for the advice. But what role do you believe pheromones play in creating buyers remorse? IE. as JesseJester suggests, the mones r doing such a good job in the seduction process, that the girls may think about it and feel that how they feel is incongruent with a normal, lateral seduction. Thus they go home after the first date and can no longer validate the feeling, OR, the next morning they feel, or intuit, and on a purely sub-conscious level [unless u told her u were wearing sprays] that u have somehow “tricked” “manipulated” or “cheated” her into feeling arousal for u through the [pheromone sprays](https://a314.com/product-category/spray-pheromones/), thus wont meet up with u again? This seems to only happen with Androstenone. AS GWTW suggests, A314 may guard against 2nd date-itis. P74? nup, didnt guard against this. I personally dont think p74 is anything more than a social. I really feel Jessejester has hit the nail on the spot here. The pheromones, combined with the wearer, can advance the seduction process at a much more rapid rate than would normally happen. The girl maybe cant handle the speed with which there feelings r created…so yes, the subsequent rejection after the 1st date is actually a compliment in a sense. That they liked me soo much, and now they r scared they’ll get hurt, or, “hey now all thats left is sex, this happened too fast, its not congruent with my normal dating experiences. I’m scared.” The interesting point here is Pheromone induced seduction sparks buyers remorse more-so than normal [non-pheromone induced] seduction for these very reasons. I think my strategy will now be to wear comfort and value pheromones on a first date. The first date actually being the second meeting. 1.So a none/ value mix for the initial meet [eg.103/tuh] which will do wonders for attraction and creating the 1st date. 2.Then move on the 1st date i will now use a comfort and value mix [eg. 103/TAH/IFM/IH], as Mystery states: “if the girl has flaked on subsequent dates, u havent shown enough comfort and/or value”. 3. Re-visit Androstenone on a 2nd date or in her apartment. Biut its definately a key element in the initial encounter, or attraction stage. ---
**Author:** ![mahalo\_silver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/8dc957/32.png) [@mahalo\_silver](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/mahalo_silver)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2009, 10:46am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/pheromone-induced-arousal-and-2nd-date-itis/28202/9 "2009-04-20T10:46:46Z")
So perhaps the more useful Pheromones to guard against “flaking” r those aimed at creating comfort and value, not arousal or attraction. we have a long list here. For comfort we have IFM, TAH, EST, IH, mx203, p86 perhaps, Tac, - i personally think tah is perfect for connectivity and sensuality. For value we have any Androsterone mix whether it be a314, mx102-105, mx172 etc. I will try ifm/tah/ih on dates now and see if 2nd date-itis improves. ---
**Author:** ![Gone\_with\_the\_Wind](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/gone_with_the_wind/32/2227_2.png) [@Gone\_with\_the\_Wind](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/Gone_with_the_Wind)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2009, 1:53am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/pheromone-induced-arousal-and-2nd-date-itis/28202/10 "2009-04-22T01:53:58Z")
I am going to recommend two old threads to your attention. > [@Tournament and pair-bonding strategies for pheromone use](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/tournament-and-pair-bonding-strategies-for-pheromone-use/4009): > > Biologists have noted two types of species with distinct physical and behavioral characteristics with regard to mating. Those are called [tournament species](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tournament_species)and [pair bonding](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pair_bond)species. In tournament species males compete for the opportunity to mate with females. They may compete via fighting like the elk, or via displays like the peacock. In pair bonding species like the swan a male and a female form a lasting pair bond. (In a very few species it is the female that competes to mate with the mal… > [@Evolutionary psychology: -Rone men and -None Men](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/evolutionary-psychology-rone-men-and-none-men/19): > > In case anybody here doesn’t know, Evolutionary Psychology PERFECTLY, and I mean PERFECTLY… outlines the rone and none relationship. They just don’t use rone and none by name. I doubt most evolutionary psychologists have ever heard of these two [pheromones](https://a314.com/shop/), despite the fact that I made the connection almost immediately… “that’s a rone man they’re talking about!” and “that’s a none man they’re talking about!”. Evolutionary psychology really does describe two types of men, one who is basically hi… ---
**Author:** ![OoohYahhh](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/ooohyahhh/32/1274_2.png) [@OoohYahhh](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/OoohYahhh)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2009, 8:27am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/pheromone-induced-arousal-and-2nd-date-itis/28202/11 "2009-04-22T08:27:26Z")
> [@Gone\_with\_the\_Wind](#): > > I am going to recommend two old threads to your attention. > > [Tournament and pair-bonding strategies for pheromone use](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/tournament-and-pair-bonding-strategies-for-pheromone-use/4009) > > [Evolutionary psychology: -Rone men and -None Men](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/evolutionary-psychology-rone-men-and-none-men/19) Excellent choices! Might I also recomend: [The orgasmatronic tension-release theory](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/the-orgasmatronic-tension-release-theory/359) from May of '06 This a thread by Tactius where he discovers the “mythical Panty Dropper” mix. From that mix he developed a theory of “contrastive pheromonal presentation” Many of the great luminaries of our time contributed to this thread. Catlord of course was probing for proportions and called the human mind a “difference engine”. Rbt disscused his mix for menstural periods. Visionary dicusses his stunningly successful application of contrastive pheromonal presentation that brought him to say, "I am an evil bastard [![](https://pheromonetalk.com/mens-pheromone-advice-tricks-tips/images/smilies/tongue.gif) ](https://pheromonetalk.com/mens-pheromone-advice-tricks-tips/images/smilies/tongue.gif) ." Dancing Joker laughing about the tiny funnels in Atena 10X. M&M asks, on behalf of everyone, for the proportions of the mix, which Tactius never does reveal. He does however go on to discuss “zen maleness” and “rich, mindbending pussy juice… rightous compost of ass” All in all, a highly entertaining thread. OoohYahhh ---
**Author:** ![OoohYahhh](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/ooohyahhh/32/1274_2.png) [@OoohYahhh](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/OoohYahhh)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2009, 7:53pm UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/pheromone-induced-arousal-and-2nd-date-itis/28202/12 "2009-04-26T19:53:04Z")
> [@Gone\_with\_the\_Wind](#): > > I am going to recommend two old threads to your attention. > > [Tournament and pair-bonding strategies for pheromone use](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/tournament-and-pair-bonding-strategies-for-pheromone-use/4009) > > [Evolutionary psychology: -Rone men and -None Men](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/evolutionary-psychology-rone-men-and-none-men/19) The Tactius theory of contrastive pheromonal presentation might have some application here. > [@The orgasmatronic tension-release theory](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/the-orgasmatronic-tension-release-theory/359): > > Backstory: mixed up an intense batch of -nols, P79, P80, dienone … about as close to the mythical panty dropper as I’ve yet compounded… women around me were getting aroused , normally conservative, restrained, professional conduct types, one found an excuse to rub up against my thighs and seemd to be struggling to control herself, another wafted off a hint of the unmistakable love aroma of woman, another, a mind spinningly beautiful south american woman was in the grip of an attraction-shyness … OoohYahhh