# Sneaky sneaky Letters. **URL:** \ **Category:** Men's Pheromone Advice & Field Reports\ **Created:** [April 28, 2009, 10:28pm UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/sneaky-sneaky-letters/28465 "2009-04-28T22:28:47Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Oakey](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/258eb7/32.png) [@Oakey](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/Oakey)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2009, 10:28pm UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/sneaky-sneaky-letters/28465/1 "2009-04-28T22:28:47Z")
Hmmm, im half asleep and thinking of writing a letter to my gf whos half the world away ☹ and suddenly i had a brainstorm what if i spray the letter with some pheros… Woohoo… lol Would the phero illicit a reaction in her? I wonder, IS for starters, maybe some ammo (i always wear it when im around her) and a half drop of A314 or a squirt of mx292. lol it might sound like a crazy idea but what do you guys think? Is it a plausible idea? ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Feel\_Good](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/mr.feel_good/32/1148_2.png) [@Mr.Feel\_Good](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/Mr.Feel_Good)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2009, 10:35pm UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/sneaky-sneaky-letters/28465/2 "2009-04-28T22:35:09Z")
Hmm, i dunno, my good man. How long does it take for a letter to reach her? I mean, cologne lasts 2-3 days or so when sprayed heavily on a shirt, so i doubt that there’d be any phero’s left on it and i’d even doubt there’d be a scent left. But that’s just my two cents. Give it a whirl if ya want, nothing to lose. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![tisha23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/53a042/32.png) [@tisha23](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/tisha23)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2009, 10:44pm UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/sneaky-sneaky-letters/28465/3 "2009-04-28T22:44:47Z")
If you can get the letter to her in 4 to 6 hours maybe. Mones will diffuse with exposure to heat and its hot as hell in those mail trucks. The mail man may really dig ya though LOL Remember when they spray the androtics packages its inside the bubble wrap which wont allow it to diffuse. paper is porous Tisha ---
**Author:** ![Gegogi](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/gegogi/32/1536_2.png) [@Gegogi](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/Gegogi)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2009, 1:09am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/sneaky-sneaky-letters/28465/4 "2009-04-29T01:09:50Z")
Androstenone will linger on paper or cloth for weeks. I dully sprayed TE on a leather jacket and could smell it for months. The problem is she may wonder if you pissed on the letter! I put SOE oil on my promotion dossier 5 years ago and signed it with a LS mone pen. Don’t know if it helped but I got promoted… ---
**Author:** ![Ball.Saxbury](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/ball.saxbury/32/1063_2.png) [@Ball.Saxbury](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/Ball.Saxbury)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2009, 1:16am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/sneaky-sneaky-letters/28465/5 "2009-04-29T01:16:39Z")
It’s been proven that [pheromones](https://a314.com/) work only under social influence. There are some lab studies on [pubmed.gov](http://pubmed.gov) that prove this, specifically with regards to androstadienone, (but this can be generalized to all pheromones). In other words, even if they did stay on the paper long enough to get there, there will be no elicited response because you are not there in person. ---
**Author:** ![tisha23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/53a042/32.png) [@tisha23](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/tisha23)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2009, 1:40am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/sneaky-sneaky-letters/28465/6 "2009-04-29T01:40:37Z")
> [@](#): > > Androstenone will linger on paper or cloth for weeks. I dully sprayed TE on a leather jacket and could smell it for months. The problem is she may wonder if you pissed on the letter! Snort, True anone can stick but do you really want her to get horny when the mail man comes. Some of us look pretty good and can be quite charming 😛 LOL Tisha ---
**Author:** ![Gegogi](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/gegogi/32/1536_2.png) [@Gegogi](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/Gegogi)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2009, 10:19am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/sneaky-sneaky-letters/28465/7 "2009-04-29T10:19:27Z")
> [@](#): > > It’s been proven that pheromones work only under social influence. There are some lab studies on [pubmed.gov](http://pubmed.gov) that prove this, specifically with regards to androstadienone, (but this can be generalized to all pheromones). Please, are you kidding me? You gotta be yanking our collective chains! Those studies gotta be a massive steaming pile 'o bullshit. What about all the people on this forum claiming self-effects when testing mones by themselves? Are they imagining the various influences? Lying? Or could it be your lab studies are fatally flawed… ---
**Author:** ![Ball.Saxbury](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/ball.saxbury/32/1063_2.png) [@Ball.Saxbury](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/Ball.Saxbury)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2009, 2:01pm UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/sneaky-sneaky-letters/28465/8 "2009-04-29T14:01:22Z")
> [@Gegogi](#): > > Please, are you kidding me? You gotta be yanking our collective chains! Those studies gotta be a massive steaming pile 'o bullshit. What about all the people on this forum claiming self-effects when testing mones by themselves? Are they imagining the various influences? Lying? Or could it be your lab studies are fatally flawed… Hmm. Well, I don’t know about self-effects. Honestly, I have always attributed that to a placebo effect. Somebody needs to do an experiment - grab a couple of different pheros, take off the labels, and get a few random people to report their self-effects to see if there is any consistency. Of course, I’m also very biased. I experience no self-effects whatsoever. Does it really surprise you that pheromones don’t do anything by themselves? (At least, based off of the experiments I’ve read.) I’m okay with this because it actually makes sense. Let’s say we have some woman walking down the street. She walks past Catlord or some guy wearing a whole bunch of -none. Now, she might pick up on that high -none signature, but she doesn’t actually know why she has this momentary fleeting sexual attraction. It has to be attributed to something, so she’ll probably attribute it to something else, “Catlord is sexy.” But, if the same scenario happened with somebody really unattractive, I imagine she’d walk right past Bruno and completely ignore him, probably blocking out the half bottle of Ammo he’s wearing entirely, because social influence comes first. I think that the pheromones have to line up correctly with social influence in order for them to work. Otherwise, I believe that we are unaffected by them entirely. Food for thought. ---
**Author:** ![TheCentaur](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ea5d25/32.png) [@TheCentaur](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/TheCentaur)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2009, 4:22pm UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/sneaky-sneaky-letters/28465/9 "2009-04-29T16:22:57Z")
have you ever tried to tickle yourself to the point of laughing? nope. you cant. someone has to do it for you. so… the social aspect will still be there, because you’ve used a plastic envelope, and your steamy love letter will remind your girlfriend of you while she’s smelling the letter. it can be the same association as the ‘old boyfriends teeshirt’ theory. ---
**Author:** ![Gegogi](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/gegogi/32/1536_2.png) [@Gegogi](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/Gegogi)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2009, 5:23pm UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/sneaky-sneaky-letters/28465/10 "2009-04-29T17:23:44Z")
Actually I experience little self-effects, but initially I did endure some pretty intense ones. GRadually faded with regular use. Same problems with weed, pain-killers, etc. Their are plenty of scientific studies detailing human biological responses to mones. Biological responses don’t necessarily translate into behavior changes as we all have painfully learned. But, yeah, obviously mones work best in a social context. I recall a “scientific study” (I thought it was a bit weak) where women sniffed cotton pads spiked with male mones (androsterone) and were asked to react to the scent. Apparently during ovulation women found the scent okay or even pleasant while being repelled by it at other points in their cycle. No social context but nevertheless a differences in response according to the point in their mensural cycle. ---
**Author:** ![Domnk](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/domnk/32/2269_2.png) [@Domnk](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/Domnk)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2009, 8:49pm UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/sneaky-sneaky-letters/28465/11 "2009-04-29T20:49:03Z")
> [@Gegogi](#): > > Their are plenty of scientific studies detailing human biological responses to mones. Biological responses don’t necessarily translate into behavior changes as we all have painfully learned. **But, yeah, obviously mones work best in a social context.** > > I recall a “scientific study” (I thought it was a bit weak) where women sniffed cotton pads spiked with male mones (androsterone) and were asked to react to the scent. Apparently during ovulation women found the scent okay or even pleasant while being repelled by it at other points in their cycle. **No social context but nevertheless a differences in response according to the point in their mensural cycle.** > [@Ball.Saxbury](#): > > I think that the pheromones have to line up correctly with social influence in order for them to work. I think we are forgetting something 🙄 We are social creatures, all operating under social conditioning whether others are present or not. We are motivated by emotional responses, and that alone is what drives a social environment. So how can we say that social context is ever absent? We cant. > [@Gegogi](#): > > \*\*\*Biological responses don’t necessarily translate into behavior changes \*\*\*_ **as we all have painfully learned** _ Are you saying that there can be a biological change and it will not affect ones actions at all? That’s contradictory to everything we know about living organisms. Biological responses influence behavior, however slight. Behavior is a cognitive facility which is influenced by thought, and thought is driven by emotion responses motivated by external\internal stimuli. In order for the biological not to influence behavior, the two processes would have to operate independently.😉 > [@Ball.Saxbury](#): > > Somebody needs to do an experiment - grab a couple of different pheros, take off the labels, and get a few random people to report their self-effects to see if there is any consistency. Actually, that has been done already… hasn’t it, Tisha? ---
**Author:** ![Gegogi](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/gegogi/32/1536_2.png) [@Gegogi](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/Gegogi)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2009, 12:55am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/sneaky-sneaky-letters/28465/12 "2009-04-30T00:55:40Z")
> [@](#): > > G writes, “Biological responses don’t necessarily translate into behavior changes as we all have painfully learned” > [@](#): > > Do askes, “Are you saying that there can be a biological change and it will not affect ones actions at all? That’s contradictory to everything we know about living organisms. > Biological responses influence behavior, however slight. Behavior is a cognitive facility which is influenced by thought, and thought is driven by emotion responses motivated by external\internal stimuli. In order for the biological not to influence behavior, the two processes would have to operate independently.” Weren’t not writing about the same thing. I’ll make it clearer for you: I was referring to wearing sexual or social mones, directing attention towards a target and getting ignored. At some level she detected the mones, generated an internal response but choose to ignore it because she found you undesirable. Maybe she’s married, thinks you look like a fuckin’ geek, is worried about her mother or is gay…the reason doesn’t matter. So she doesn’t smile back, respond to your questions and/or walks off. That’s what I’m writing about. ---
**Author:** ![Ball.Saxbury](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/ball.saxbury/32/1063_2.png) [@Ball.Saxbury](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/Ball.Saxbury)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2009, 1:20am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/sneaky-sneaky-letters/28465/13 "2009-04-30T01:20:15Z")
> [@Gegogi](#): > > Actually I experience little self-effects, but initially I did endure some pretty intense ones. GRadually faded with regular use. Same problems with weed, pain-killers, etc. > > Their are plenty of scientific studies detailing human biological responses to mones. Biological responses don’t necessarily translate into behavior changes as we all have painfully learned. But, yeah, obviously mones work best in a social context. > > I recall a “scientific study” (I thought it was a bit weak) where women sniffed cotton pads spiked with male mones (androsterone) and were asked to react to the scent. Apparently during ovulation women found the scent okay or even pleasant while being repelled by it at other points in their cycle. No social context but nevertheless a differences in response according to the point in their mensural cycle. I was referring to a couple of studies on androstadienone, double-blind and peer-reviewed, where it was shown that the (mood-enhancement) responses were only had when there was a male present. So, this makes it look to me as if we might not even experience responses to pheromones on a biological level if it’s not “socially acceptable” for this to happen. I don’t know if this can be generalized to other pheromones, though, it might only be androstadienone. ---
**Author:** ![Domnk](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/domnk/32/2269_2.png) [@Domnk](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/Domnk)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2009, 2:08am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/sneaky-sneaky-letters/28465/14 "2009-04-30T02:08:41Z")
But that would mean that the results gathered on this forum, women using IFM to help PMS symptoms, is invalid. I’ve heard that some women don’t get any self effects at all when using IFM and read that it also helps great for others. So, maybe it is just that some people don’t really respond to androstadienone the same way as others typically report. > [@Ball.Saxbury](#): > > I was referring to a couple of studies on androstadienone, double-blind and peer-reviewed, where it was shown that the (mood-enhancement) responses were only had when there was a male present. > > So, this makes it look to me as if we might not even experience responses to pheromones on a biological level if it’s not “socially acceptable” for this to happen. > > I don’t know if this can be generalized to other pheromones, though, it might only be androstadienone. ---
**Author:** ![Ball.Saxbury](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/ball.saxbury/32/1063_2.png) [@Ball.Saxbury](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/Ball.Saxbury)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2009, 2:19am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/sneaky-sneaky-letters/28465/15 "2009-04-30T02:19:50Z")
> [@Domnk](#): > > But that would mean that the results gathered on this forum, women using IFM to help PMS symptoms, is invalid. I’ve heard that some women don’t get any self effects at all when using IFM and read that it also helps great for others. So, maybe it is just that some people don’t really respond to androstadienone the same way as others typically report. Well, yes, it would imply that. Placebo effect, anybody? Not to offend anyone. But the studies do seem to imply this. ---
**Author:** ![Domnk](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/domnk/32/2269_2.png) [@Domnk](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/Domnk)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2009, 2:53am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/sneaky-sneaky-letters/28465/16 "2009-04-30T02:53:01Z")
> [@Ball.Saxbury](#): > > Well, yes, it would imply that. Placebo effect, anybody? Not to offend anyone. But the studies do seem to imply this. Speculation won’t get us anywhere, but we could try and get people to participate in a blind test, were some women use androstadienone during their cycle and others receive a placebo during that period and both groups record their reactions, if any. What do you think? ---
**Author:** ![Ball.Saxbury](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/ball.saxbury/32/1063_2.png) [@Ball.Saxbury](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/Ball.Saxbury)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2009, 3:00am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/sneaky-sneaky-letters/28465/17 "2009-04-30T03:00:48Z")
> [@Domnk](#): > > Speculation won’t get us anywhere, but we could try and get people to participate in a blind test, were some women use androstadienone during their cycle and others receive a placebo during that period and both groups record their reactions, if any. What do you think? Good idea. Also, it is quite possible that there can be self-effects without social influence with androstadienone during PMS. The sensitivity could shoot way up, as the sense of smell and sensitivity to -none does with the monthly cycle. I honestly don’t know. The study didn’t take take any of this into consideration. ---
**Author:** ![Domnk](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/domnk/32/2269_2.png) [@Domnk](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/Domnk)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2009, 3:06am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/sneaky-sneaky-letters/28465/18 "2009-04-30T03:06:55Z")
When I can, I’ll create a poll in the women’s section to see who would be willing to do the test, or variation thereupon. 🙂 > [@Ball.Saxbury](#): > > Good idea. > > Also, it is quite possible that there can be self-effects without social influence with androstadienone during PMS. The sensitivity could shoot way up, as the sense of smell and sensitivity to -none does with the monthly cycle. I honestly don’t know. The study didn’t take take any of this into consideration. ---
**Author:** ![Gegogi](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/gegogi/32/1536_2.png) [@Gegogi](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/Gegogi)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2009, 7:41am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/sneaky-sneaky-letters/28465/19 "2009-04-30T07:41:34Z")
> [@](#): > > In two trials, a total of 48 undergraduate women at UC Berkeley were asked to take 20 sniffs from a bottle containing androstadienone, which smells vaguely musky. Over a period of two hours, the volunteers provided five saliva samples from which cortisol levels were determined. > > Compared to their response when sniffing a control odor (yeast), the women who sniffed androstadienone reported an improved mood and significantly higher sexual arousal, while their physiological response, including blood pressure, heart rate and breathing, also increased. This was consistent with previous studies. > > [University of California - UC Newsroom | Male sweat boosts women’s hormone levels](http://www.universityofcalifornia.edu/news/article/8890) I’m not sure how “social” sniffing bottles of A1 in a college lab is but these women did demonstrate a biological response. Whether or not these biological responses manifest themselves in physical behavior is dependent on the individual and other persons present. I’m guessing a doggie breath lab assistant probably didn’t inspire too many participants to act on their mood enhancement or arousal. ---
**Author:** ![Ball.Saxbury](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/ball.saxbury/32/1063_2.png) [@Ball.Saxbury](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/Ball.Saxbury)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2009, 7:50am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/sneaky-sneaky-letters/28465/20 "2009-04-30T07:50:08Z")
> [@Gegogi](#): > > I’m not sure how “social” sniffing bottles of A1 in a college lab is but these women did demonstrate a biological response. Whether or not these biological responses manifest themselves in physical behavior is dependent on the individual and other persons present. I’m guessing a doggie breath lab assistant probably didn’t inspire too many participants to act on their mood enhancement or arousal. I would like to apologize to all - I have done more digging and have changed my opinions about what I said earlier. I was able to find about six or seven studies on [pubmed.gov](http://pubmed.gov) that show A1 having biological effects without the presence of a male. There is the one that claims that it only works if the experimenter is male, but this appears incorrect because I found this information in only one of the thirty or so A1-related studies in total which show a response, biological or behavioral. I hadn’t done enough research, and I was wrong. It appears that A1 does work as a [pheromone](https://a314.com/shop/) without social influence. Again, sorry to everybody, I was apparently giving out incorrect information. [Next page](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/sneaky-sneaky-letters/28465.md?page=2)