# Ta-/putatives/chemical names? **URL:** \ **Category:** Men's Pheromone Advice & Field Reports\ **Created:** [March 1, 2007, 5:46am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/ta-putatives-chemical-names/2278 "2007-03-01T05:46:38Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 14\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![toilofday](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/toilofday/32/371_2.png) [@toilofday](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/toilofday)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2007, 5:46am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/ta-putatives-chemical-names/2278/1 "2007-03-01T05:46:38Z")
Does anybody know the chemical name for any Ta- or Putatives? ---
**Author:** ![Jasmin](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/jasmin/32/287_2.png) [@Jasmin](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/Jasmin)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2007, 6:25am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/ta-putatives-chemical-names/2278/2 "2007-03-01T06:25:19Z")
I do! … but that’s top secret information. We used to be very open about what molecules we were using. Some years ago, we were the first to introduce Beta Androstenol to the market. For months, we were slammed, and slammed HARD by other [pheromone](https://pheromonelabs.com/shop/) companies and distributors. “Beta nol doesn’t exist.” “Beta nol doesn’t work.” “Beta nol is a scam.” Almost **exactly** 4 months later, other sites started copying us and carrying Beta Nol. Beta nol’s a scam, huh? A fair amount of our intellectual property gets stolen. The moment we release a chemical name, we are _always_ slandered, and then _always_ copied. Also, we like to “genericize” all the different molecules here so that we don’t lead the audience with biases. This is a research and development forum, and we want the best feedback possible. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Thalion](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/f475e1/32.png) [@Thalion](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/Thalion)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2007, 6:47am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/ta-putatives-chemical-names/2278/3 "2007-03-01T06:47:45Z")
Toil, if Jasmin tells you, she’ll just have to hunt you down and kill you. I don’t think she wants to do that. Blood and [pheromones](https://pheromonelabs.com/) don’t mix well. ---
**Author:** ![toilofday](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/toilofday/32/371_2.png) [@toilofday](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/toilofday)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2007, 7:00am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/ta-putatives-chemical-names/2278/4 "2007-03-01T07:00:26Z")
Jas, so many of the molocules offered as putatives and the like were created by androtics? hmmm… Would Taa be one of them? When I researched Taa I found some rather confusing information that was related to Er-1 (whatever that is) ---
**Author:** ![Gegogi](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/gegogi/32/1536_2.png) [@Gegogi](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/Gegogi)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2007, 9:55am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/ta-putatives-chemical-names/2278/5 "2007-03-01T09:55:17Z")
[Pheromone products](https://a314.com/shop/) don’t have to play by the same rules as food and drugs, thus their makers are not legally bond to reveal their brew. Personally I’m extremely hesitate to purchase something I don’t know what the hell it is. Perhaps a junior scientist among us might do a bit of chemical analysis and share. In fairness, Androtics isn’t the only phero biz to keep their brew a secret. On the other hand there are some that play a bit looser. JVK is wide open with his Scent of Eros mix (one of my favs) and Love Scent has practiced partial disclosure and often hints at the secrets. They must prefer more informed buyers or feel disclosure is more alluring. It certainly makes testing, dosage and mixes easier. A mystery mix takes a hoe lotta funkin’ around to figure out what it does and what mixes well with it. The before mentioned secrecy is the main reason I prefer to roll my own mixes from chemset pheromones. At least I know exactly what I’m getting into. ---
**Author:** ![sigma](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/dec6dc/32.png) [@sigma](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/sigma)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2007, 3:08pm UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/ta-putatives-chemical-names/2278/6 "2007-03-01T15:08:08Z")
> [@Gegogi](#): > > Pheromone products don’t have to play by the same rules as food and drugs, thus their makers are not legally bond to reveal their brew. Personally I’m extremely hesitate to purchase something I don’t know what the hell it is. Perhaps a junior scientist among us might do a bit of chemical analysis and share. > > In fairness, Androtics isn’t the only phero biz to keep their brew a secret. On the other hand there are some that play a bit looser. JVK is wide open with his Scent of Eros mix (one of my favs) and Love Scent has practiced partial disclosure and often hints at the secrets. They must prefer more informed buyers or feel disclosure is more alluring. It certainly makes testing, dosage and mixes easier. A mystery mix takes a hoe lotta funkin’ around to figure out what it does and what mixes well with it. The before mentioned secrecy is the main reason I prefer to roll my own mixes from chemset pheromones. At least I know exactly what I’m getting into. And as a result, many people are going around brewing their own soe, as opposed to buying JVKohl’s brew. Given the right resources, its quite easy to copy someone else’s formulations and individual pheromones. I can see why Androtics would prefer to code their molecules, as it keeps other companies from benefiting from their R&D. I’m quite sure TAA would have been copied by another company by now had they disclosed the actual molecule name. (I have a hunch about what it is though!). TAH, TAL, P79, P83, P93 would likely have been copied eventually. I would prefer to know the chemical names of the molecules they release, as the name of the molecule really gives you some idea of what its supposed to do. But I think that as you grow more acquainted to these individual molecules and what they do, you can make due without really knowing what they really are. As long as they work, I’m content without knowing what they really are. I too am not really a fan of highly complex, secretive mixes though. Makes for a whole lot of guesswork, and you really don’t have much control over the effects. Those mixes really are a hit or miss type of affair. ---
**Author:** ![unknown\_user88](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/unknown_user88/32/842_2.png) [@unknown\_user88](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/unknown_user88)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2007, 9:58pm UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/ta-putatives-chemical-names/2278/7 "2007-03-01T21:58:12Z")
LS do tell you whats in their products alot, but you have to know the basics of each type of pheromone in order to find out or have any idea of what reaction they give, but they never give the ratio of their products making it harder for others to copy it themselves, thats why i prefer this site, you kin dof know what reactions to look for, i still don’t know what to expect from my chikara, but my androtics order is on its way so i’m hopin it’ll arrive soon. ---
**Author:** ![Marik](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/marik/32/1623_2.png) [@Marik](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/Marik)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2007, 11:11pm UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/ta-putatives-chemical-names/2278/8 "2007-03-01T23:11:40Z")
> [@sigma](#): > > I’m quite sure TAA would have been copied by another company by now had they disclosed the actual molecule name. (I have a hunch about what it is though!). Let’s play! what is your hunch? > [@sigma](#): > > I too am not really a fan of highly complex, secretive mixes though. Makes for a whole lot of guesswork, and you really don’t have much control over the effects. Those mixes really are a hit or miss type of affair. I agree, it’s difficult to know what’s wrong with multiple pheromones mixes. ---
**Author:** ![Gegogi](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/gegogi/32/1536_2.png) [@Gegogi](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/Gegogi)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2007, 12:01am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/ta-putatives-chemical-names/2278/9 "2007-03-02T00:01:57Z")
> [@](#): > > And as a result, many people are going around brewing their own Scent of Eros, as opposed to buying JVKohl’s brew. Yep, I’m gulity as charged. Oddly I still buy the oil based Scent of Eros as it’s almost as cost effective as rolling your own. I only roll my own so I can use an alcohol carrier (mixes better with cologne in an atomizer). I read food ingredients but rarely feel moved to make my own from scratch. I think most pheromone users are interested in ingredients but few will actually buy the chemsets and mix their own combo products. Most folks have a busy life and crave speed and convenience. Otherwise we’d all be sewing our own clothing, baking cakes from scratch and brewing beer… > [@](#): > > ou kin dof know what reactions to look for Hmm, I find my reactions and dosage varies considerably from the norm and prefer to test myself, so I take those observations with a huge boulder of rock salt. Over the years I’ve learned what and how much normally works for me. Your mileage will certainly vary. ---
**Author:** ![Jasmin](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/jasmin/32/287_2.png) [@Jasmin](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/Jasmin)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2007, 2:43am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/ta-putatives-chemical-names/2278/10 "2007-03-02T02:43:15Z")
> [@Gegogi](#): > > Yep, I’m gulity as charged. Oddly I still buy the oil based Scent of Eros as it’s almost as cost effective as rolling your own. I only roll my own so I can use an alcohol carrier (mixes better with cologne in an atomizer). I read food ingredients but rarely feel moved to make my own from scratch. Every now and then when the Custom Pheromone Builder is available, without fail I see a few orders of SOE clones. I always get jealous of the guys, 'cause they get that already results-bearing SOE formula made with American synthesized molecules for the same price or less (depending on the dosage they get). > [@](#): > > I think most pheromone users are interested in ingredients but few will actually buy the chemsets and mix their own combo products. Most folks have a busy life and crave speed and convenience. Otherwise we’d all be sewing our own clothing, baking cakes from scratch and brewing beer… Oh, my god, Gegogi, logic would totally have me thinking the same thing. Americans are so extremely impatient and busy, that even if they _wanted_ to taste the Beer Of The Gods on their tongue by brewing it themselves, they aren’t going to if it takes out a huge portion of the day. Interestingly, though I’ve observed that once our users “get” the pheromonal effects of the Instant Line, or what pheromones can do for _them_, they get super curious and start delving into all the experimentals and putatives, or start rolling their own mixes. I literally have fireside chats on the phone with forum members (who quite literally have their own busy 25 hour a day lives) and testers alike for up to a couple hours a day, dissecting mixes and swapping hit stories. It ends up being REALLY awesome - I have people like catlord, examine, dancing\_joker and attractor sharing their mixes down to the component, and we pick it apart, try it on the people around us, and report back to each other. The modularity and consistency of how our products are formatted make this “recipe swapping” soooo easy. I literally have guys who are fierce NY stock brokers for 18 hours of the day, come home, roll up their sleeves, pull out all their ingredients, and play the pheromonal equivalent of Betty Crocker. I actually have to discourage newbies on the phone from jumping the gun on Experimones, because I’d rather see them cutting their chops on tried and true Instant Products, first. ---
**Author:** ![Socrates](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/3bc359/32.png) [@Socrates](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/Socrates)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2007, 8:53am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/ta-putatives-chemical-names/2278/11 "2007-03-02T08:53:21Z")
> [@sigma](#): > > And as a result, many people are going around brewing their own Scent of Eros, as opposed to buying JVKohl’s brew. Given the right resources, its quite easy to copy someone else’s formulations and individual pheromones. I can see why Androtics would prefer to code their molecules, as it keeps other companies from benefiting from their R&D. I’m quite sure TAA would have been copied by another company by now had they disclosed the actual molecule name. (I have a hunch about what it is though!). TAH, TAL, P79, P83, P93 would likely have been copied eventually. > > I would prefer to know the chemical names of the molecules they release, as the name of the molecule really gives you some idea of what its supposed to do. But I think that as you grow more acquainted to these individual molecules and what they do, you can make due without really knowing what they really are. As long as they work, I’m content without knowing what they really are. > > I too am not really a fan of highly complex, secretive mixes though. Makes for a whole lot of guesswork, and you really don’t have much control over the effects. Those mixes really are a hit or miss type of affair. I personally do not really care if something has the chemical name or it doesn’t, if it works and I like the results and I can keep getting it then what does it matter right? Sure I am curious what chemical names the useful putatives but I agree that Androtics should reap any benefits they can get from the good work that they have done in synthesising new compounds in the US and making them widely available. Another thing is that you can get access to ‘new molecules’ at Androtics (Putatives 74-93 so far) for just 15 USD. Yes that is the amount for the 2.5 [mcg](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microgram)/spray bottle but think about it, all you need is to spray that 10 times and you have 25 [mcg](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microgram) of [putative](https://a314.com/) on yourself. Now I would think that going through an entire 2.5 [mcg](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microgram)/spray bottle of the [putative](https://a314.com/), would make you realise whether this is something useful and you would buy again (perhaps at a stronger concentration), or whether it serves no useful purpose for you. Nowhere else would you get access to a ‘new molecule’ for 15 USD. I agree with Sigma about not being “a fan of highly complex, secretive mixes though. Makes for a whole lot of guesswork, and you really don’t have much control over the effects. Those mixes really are a hit or miss type of affair.” I especially don’t like it when -None gets added in when a lot of guys have trouble wearing -None. What are they supposed to do? They don’t get the benefits of the new molecules because their body chemistry doesn’t work with one of the other ingredients in the mix that they just don’t need (whether it be -None or something else ‘distancing’). Visionary ---
**Author:** ![toilofday](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/toilofday/32/371_2.png) [@toilofday](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/toilofday)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2007, 9:19am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/ta-putatives-chemical-names/2278/12 "2007-03-02T09:19:13Z")
This came about because I was looking at the chemical structures of different phermone molocules. As far as I remeber, the andro-'s all had CH3 bonds and their differences where the OH and H bonds and the number that they were bonded. (double bonds, tripple, ect…). I was hopeing to find a patern between molocule structure and effect. The est- and the meo-'s were a little more complicated, but shared a similar set of differences. ---
**Author:** ![Nunya](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/ac8455/32.png) [@Nunya](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/Nunya)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2007, 12:37pm UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/ta-putatives-chemical-names/2278/13 "2007-03-02T12:37:04Z")
right - so pretty soon i will be baking cookies from scratch as I have some b-nol in alcohol available to me, and i’ve got some experimones and putatives on the way. I’ve got a hazy idea of a combo i’d like to try, but a- i need to test each by itself first, so I have an idea. But then - where do i start? Actually Jas- i’ll prolly be calling you when the time comes. _lol_ ---
**Author:** ![Gegogi](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/gegogi/32/1536_2.png) [@Gegogi](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/Gegogi)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2007, 6:42pm UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/ta-putatives-chemical-names/2278/14 "2007-03-02T18:42:31Z")
Actually I find alpha androstenol by itself pretty effective. Sometimes I dab on a bit before visiting a friend and it really loosens their tongue. I have a couple 10ml bottles of concentrated alpha androstenol and was surprised at how musky it smells compared to commercial androstenol products (after drydown). Normally I use it with a bit of androstenone, beta alpha and/or A-1.