# togo or 30ml? **URL:** \ **Category:** Men's Pheromone Advice & Field Reports\ **Created:** [June 19, 2012, 7:38pm UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/togo-or-30ml/55916 "2012-06-19T19:38:25Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 10\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![bemsha](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/df705f/32.png) [@bemsha](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/bemsha)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2012, 7:38pm UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/togo-or-30ml/55916/1 "2012-06-19T19:38:25Z")
Okay I’ve searched for a while to the answer to this one, but none of the threads actually touch on the exact question I have. I’m going to be buying some putatives: p74, p75, p79, and p83. Yes I’m new and yes I know it’s not recommended for noobs. I sincerely appreciate that advice, but I’m gonna order them anyway. I’m very scientific minded and think I can use them responsibly and chart my progress with them and get to know them well. With all due respect to those who would try to talk me out of it, it’s going to happen. My question is this: do most people here go with the togo sized, or 30ml sized? If I want to buy the cheapest version of either, it’s either gonna be 12.5 mcg/spray for the 5ml, or 2.5 mcg/spray for the 30ml. Those are kind of two extremes. If I find my sweet spot to be 25mcg, that’s 10 sprays of the 30ml!! Even if It’s just 5 sprays, does the neroli scent still dissipate to a tolerable, non cologne level at that amount of sprays? What’s the most recommended amount of sprays for 6% neroli? I’d like to not have to spend almost 50 bucks just to be able to not have to smell like “[Neroli](https://a314.com/product-category/scented/androtics-neroli/) Man”, but also get a bottle that doesn’t leak. Any insight here would be greatly appreciated. ---
**Author:** ![bemsha](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/df705f/32.png) [@bemsha](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/bemsha)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2012, 7:40pm UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/togo-or-30ml/55916/2 "2012-06-19T19:40:51Z")
Also, I know I’m new here, but it does seem like it’d be super cool to have a 5ml option for a lesser concentration that 12.5mcg/spray. ---
**Author:** ![pherospider](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/a88e4f/32.png) [@pherospider](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/pherospider)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2012, 9:25pm UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/togo-or-30ml/55916/3 "2012-06-19T21:25:16Z")
i purchased p83 @ 2.5 mcg , usually it works above 25 mcg in my case , for that i hav to spray 10 shots and i run out of application points , its best to hav togo of 5 ml or 30 ml @ 12 mcg , so tht 2-3 spray makes you a gud working dose . ---
**Author:** ![tisha23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/53a042/32.png) [@tisha23](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/tisha23)\ **Post date:** [June 20, 2012, 12:20am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/togo-or-30ml/55916/4 "2012-06-20T00:20:40Z")
12.5 mcg is the standard for testing bottles. Once you know your sweet spot then you can either up it or down it. P79 only comes in 5 ml so that choice is made. The rest have more options. You should always start with the to-go size. > [@](#): > > If I find my sweet spot to be 25mcg, that’s 10 sprays of the 30ml!! Even if It’s just 5 sprays, does the neroli scent still dissipate to a tolerable, non cologne level at that amount of sprays? What’s the most recommended amount of sprays for 6% neroli? I can get away with 8 to 10 sprays but after that your overdoing scent. Tisha ---
**Author:** ![bemsha](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/df705f/32.png) [@bemsha](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/bemsha)\ **Post date:** [June 20, 2012, 1:18am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/togo-or-30ml/55916/5 "2012-06-20T01:18:29Z")
> [@tisha23](#): > > 12.5 mcg is the standard for testing bottles. Once you know your sweet spot then you can either up it or down it. > > P79 only comes in 5 ml so that choice is made. The rest have more options. > > You should always start with the to-go size. > > I can get away with 8 to 10 sprays but after that your overdoing scent. > > Tisha It just seems to me like there’s too much room between 0, 12.5, and 25, and 37.5 mcg. Seems to me that a sweet spot would more often than not fall between those numbers. ---
**Author:** ![tisha23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/53a042/32.png) [@tisha23](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/tisha23)\ **Post date:** [June 20, 2012, 3:04am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/togo-or-30ml/55916/6 "2012-06-20T03:04:00Z")
> [@bemsha](#): > > It just seems to me like there’s too much room between 0, 12.5, and 25, and 37.5 mcg. Seems to me that a sweet spot would more often than not fall between those numbers. Well putatives are not stand alone products. They generally are for steering. Most people here use way way to much because when they layer they still use there “sweet spot” amount. Thats not how it works. For instance suppose your sweet spot is 25 mcg for let just say [P83](https://pheromonelabs.com/product/p83/) solo. You would only layer about 1/4 to 1/2 that much if you used it with other mixes. If you look at some of the formulas that Jasmin posted long time back they rarely use more then 2.5 to 5 mcg of most putatives in a mix to steer the primary experimones. 12.5 mcg is the standard for the putative testing program for when your testing the putative solo to report its effects which is the whole purpose of the advanced section. AD found its a good middle ground place to test from what Jasmin said and I tend to agree with her. Its up to you though but since your just starting out may as well do it right so you can become a reporting user and get discounts. Tisha ---
**Author:** ![bemsha](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/df705f/32.png) [@bemsha](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/bemsha)\ **Post date:** [June 20, 2012, 11:15am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/togo-or-30ml/55916/7 "2012-06-20T11:15:25Z")
> [@tisha23](#): > > Well putatives are not stand alone products. They generally are for steering. Most people here use way way to much because when they layer they still use there “sweet spot” amount. Thats not how it works. > > For instance suppose your sweet spot is 25 mcg for let just say P83 solo. You would only layer about 1/4 to 1/2 that much if you used it with other mixes. > > If you look at some of the formulas that Jasmin posted long time back they rarely use more then 2.5 to 5 mcg of most putatives in a mix to steer the primary experimones. > > 12.5 mcg is the standard for the putative testing program for when your testing the putative solo to report its effects which is the whole purpose of the advanced section. AD found its a good middle ground place to test from what Jasmin said and I tend to agree with her. > > Its up to you though but since your just starting out may as well do it right so you can become a reporting user and get discounts. > > Tisha Thanks for the informative and thorough response, Tisha! So I guess the togo bottles are for testing solo, and the 30ml bottles are for steering once you find what that putative does for you. So, when testing, should I just use one spray of a putative from a togo bottle and wear nothing else? Would it be an OD to use the togo bottle when wearing it with other mones, like say ammo or [Instant Shine](https://a314.com/product/shine/)? ---
**Author:** ![mobocaster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/c2a13f/32.png) [@mobocaster](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/mobocaster)\ **Post date:** [June 20, 2012, 12:18pm UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/togo-or-30ml/55916/8 "2012-06-20T12:18:29Z")
> [@bemsha](#): > > Would it be an OD to use the togo bottle when wearing it with other mones, like say ammo or Instant Shine? That’s what you have to discern from testing - but most generally, one spray of any phero at any concentration is where you start. ---
**Author:** ![tisha23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/53a042/32.png) [@tisha23](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/tisha23)\ **Post date:** [June 20, 2012, 1:32pm UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/togo-or-30ml/55916/9 "2012-06-20T13:32:38Z")
> [@bemsha](#): > > Thanks for the informative and thorough response, Tisha! So I guess the togo bottles are for testing solo, and the 30ml bottles are for steering once you find what that putative does for you. So, when testing, should I just use one spray of a putative from a togo bottle and wear nothing else? Would it be an OD to use the togo bottle when wearing it with other mones, like say ammo or Instant Shine? Yes you begin with one spray, solo with no other mones. I usually do one spray and try to determine if I feel any self effects first. I jot those down. Then I will wear that one spray (with no other mones out). Don’t look for just attraction signals although you want to watch for those. Try to observe **behavior changes**. This is easiest to do with people you know but are not extremely close to. Jot down anything that could be an effect from the mones no matter how bizarre inconsequential or uncertain. It could be mood changes, changes in normal body language, changes in how they interact with you. Next day try two sprays and do the same. Jot down results. Next day three sprays. … etc etc You may also want to play with your application points. I am not sure how long you have been using mones but I think your fairly new. After using the consumers and mixes for a while you learn your best application points. It can differ for everyone. If you dont know yet then you may want to try a few different points as you test the putatives. After about as week of doing this go back and look at your notes. Usually you see a pattern or a word that keeps popping up that helps you determine what the putative is doing if anything. You will also see at what dose you saw these behaviors most prominently. Then you can move on to layering with one of the mixes. Like I mentioned your goal is to steer it, not change it. Then you move onto layering different putatives and experimones to come up with your own formulas that are unique to you and your needs. Oh one more thing, have fun doing it. Try to set it and forget it, take your notes at the end of the day when you get home. Tisha ---
**Author:** ![bemsha](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/df705f/32.png) [@bemsha](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/bemsha)\ **Post date:** [June 20, 2012, 1:46pm UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/togo-or-30ml/55916/10 "2012-06-20T13:46:53Z")
> [@tisha23](#): > > Yes you begin with one spray, solo with no other mones. > > I usually do one spray and try to determine if I feel any self effects first. I jot those down. > > Then I will wear that one spray (with no other mones out). > > Don’t look for just attraction signals although you want to watch for those. Try to observe **behavior changes**. This is easiest to do with people you know but are not extremely close to. > > Jot down anything that could be an effect from the mones no matter how bizarre inconsequential or uncertain. It could be mood changes, changes in normal body language, changes in how they interact with you. > > Next day try two sprays and do the same. Jot down results. > > Next day three sprays. … etc etc > > You may also want to play with your application points. I am not sure how long you have been using mones but I think your fairly new. After using the consumers and mixes for a while you learn your best application points. It can differ for everyone. If you dont know yet then you may want to try a few different points as you test the putatives. > > After about as week of doing this go back and look at your notes. Usually you see a pattern or a word that keeps popping up that helps you determine what the putative is doing if anything. You will also see at what dose you saw these behaviors most prominently. > > Then you can move on to layering with one of the mixes. Like I mentioned your goal is to steer it, not change it. > > Then you move onto layering different putatives and experimones to come up with your own formulas that are unique to you and your needs. > > Oh one more thing, have fun doing it. Try to set it and forget it, take your notes at the end of the day when you get home. > > Tisha You are a fountain of knowledge! Thank you so much, Tisha!