# Up-and-down results **URL:** \ **Category:** Men's Pheromone Advice & Field Reports\ **Created:** [May 15, 2010, 3:53am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/up-and-down-results/38617 "2010-05-15T03:53:07Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![mr\_clavet](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d2c977/32.png) [@mr\_clavet](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/mr_clavet)\ **Post date:** [May 15, 2010, 3:53am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/up-and-down-results/38617/1 "2010-05-15T03:53:07Z")
Hey guys, the title says it all, but I’ll explain it a bit so you can help me out with this. I received my order about 2 weeks ago. I got: - [Instant Honesty](https://a314.com/product/instant-honesty/) - Ammo F22 - Instant Openess 2x - Turn Up The Heat (freebie) First 4 days I tried IO and IH, not combined, trying to see what was my sweet spot for them. I’ve worn them at college and I saw really no difference in other’s behavior or even in mine. Even wiith 4 sprays of IO 2x, I saw nothing. I wanted to see results, so at day 5 I tried a mix: 2 shots of IO 2x, 1 Ammo. As simple as that. I went to the movie theater and got some nice results (IOI, girls staring at me, etc). The next day, I tried the same mix at my job. I work as a cashier in a grossery store and I see a lot of different people. Tought it could be interesting to see what the effect would be on them. Unfortunately, there was no results at all. Except that I was in a pretty bad mood, without knowing why. I tried it again the day after. I taught that it might have been because I wasn’t in a good mood and that my body language wasn’t open to poeple around. This time I wasn’t in a bad mood, but still no results. After a few days off, I tried another mix. 2 x IH, 2 x IO(2x), 2 x Ammo. Went to job, and then, guess what, no difference. No IOI, no one more talkative, not even me more talkative. Just a normal day. So the title says: up and down results… But there’s really more down then there’s up. I haven’t surrender yet (and I won’t), but I’m kinda disappointed with those results so far. I can’t figure why a mix could work well one night, and then nothing. As I said, I won’t surrender, but i’d really like to understand what mistake I’ve made. I know it works, I saw it… once. ---
**Author:** ![walkitout](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/5daacb/32.png) [@walkitout](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/walkitout)\ **Post date:** [May 15, 2010, 3:58am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/up-and-down-results/38617/2 "2010-05-15T03:58:51Z")
I was at a similar point with IO and IH alone, until I found IH hitting pretty hard with some friends of mine. We kept chatting and revealing things to each other then one of them said, “wow we usually arent this honest”, and he does not know such a thing as [pheromones](https://pheromonelabs.com/shop/) exist. Spoke to someone today while wearing IS and they told me something along the lines of “wow i feel a lot better for some reason”, after we finished talking. As far as IO is concerned, I got chattiness and silliness (mostly silly time wasting jokes from girls). My favorite mix with my three socials is: 4 sprays IO: 1 neck. 1 each arm, and 1 spread between both wrists 4 sprays IH: Same as IO 4 Sprays IS: All sides of neck, with a little rubbing on back of hands. I cant wait till my Ammo F22, P83, TUTH, and Mx297 arrive 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![mr\_clavet](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d2c977/32.png) [@mr\_clavet](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/mr_clavet)\ **Post date:** [May 15, 2010, 7:48am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/up-and-down-results/38617/3 "2010-05-15T07:48:52Z")
Well thx for the feedback but that doesn’t help me… I still don’t know what I’ve been doing wrong. Am I using too little? Too much socials? Not looking for the right results? ---
**Author:** ![MisterMagik](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/mistermagik/32/2360_2.png) [@MisterMagik](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/MisterMagik)\ **Post date:** [May 15, 2010, 8:11am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/up-and-down-results/38617/4 "2010-05-15T08:11:35Z")
Hits can be super subtle. Unless you’ve trained yourself to actually see them, they’ll be as subtle as a millisecond. With getting hits with other guys, usually with IH, I get life story results and it is rather blatent. With women, I know I would miss probably 80% of the hits if I hadn’t taught myself to catch them. Its not easy either, and I’m certain I miss a good amount now even after training and studying. ---
**Author:** ![renny](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/renny/32/2104_2.png) [@renny](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/renny)\ **Post date:** [May 15, 2010, 12:46pm UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/up-and-down-results/38617/5 "2010-05-15T12:46:14Z")
You could be expecting too much or expecting the wrong thing. I suggest just maintaining a certain amount of one product (say 2 sprays of IO2x) for 3 days then going two days without and then 3 more days on. That should give you a comparison of how those around you act when wearing and when you are not. I think for many folks the breakthrough of understanding pheromones comes when you can put it on and then forget you are wearing it. At the end of the day you think “Damn that was crazy.” then you you go “…Oh yeaaaahhh!?! That’s what these guys are talking about.” ---
**Author:** ![Gegogi](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/gegogi/32/1536_2.png) [@Gegogi](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/Gegogi)\ **Post date:** [May 15, 2010, 4:48pm UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/up-and-down-results/38617/6 "2010-05-15T16:48:04Z")
Using mones successfully is like playing a musical instrument. Anyone can buy an expensive guitar or piano. But you gotta study, practice and invest a lot of effort and emotion if you wanna sound good. With mones, you need to smile and initiate conversation, make witty remarks, make eye contact (non-creepy way of course), etc., in order to see results. IO or IH will not make anyone talk who isn’t interested in talking. That’s you’re job. What it does is help it flow once you’ve opened the floodgates. In other words, it’s still basically you but amped up a little. An edge if you will. There is no massive transformation, revoking of social requirements or defeat of freewill. But used skillfully, mones maximize the return on your investment of time and effort, and that edge is what it’s all about. Test mones in a better social context like a singles bar, club, party, dinner with friends, etc. People go to those places with the intent and expectation to socialize, even bump uglies. Public places like malls, grocery stores, lecture halls, etc., are places where most people are not in the mood or expecting to socialize. They’re focused on doing other stuff and strangers bothering them don’t compute. I don’t wanna talk to anyone when I’m in Safeway. Just wanna get in and out as fast as possible. There is a gotcha. The amping up part. It also works for negative energy, so avoid mones if you’re depressed or feeling mean. It will draw attention to you in a bad way. ---
**Author:** ![mr\_clavet](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d2c977/32.png) [@mr\_clavet](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/mr_clavet)\ **Post date:** [May 15, 2010, 5:25pm UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/up-and-down-results/38617/7 "2010-05-15T17:25:11Z")
Thanks guys, I’ll keep testing and I’ll try them in different (more social) situations. In 1 week I’m going to do a 5 weeks immersion in a university with a bunch of strangers. Last year I did it and went to Halifax, should be a nice testing field since it’s composed of 200 poeple (16-20 years old). Last year, on the 200 poeple, there was like 160 girls 😃 I might start a journal if some of you guys are interested in the results. ---
**Author:** ![P51Mustang](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/p51mustang/32/1266_2.png) [@P51Mustang](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/P51Mustang)\ **Post date:** [May 15, 2010, 5:27pm UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/up-and-down-results/38617/8 "2010-05-15T17:27:12Z")
Yeah, blatant hits from women will rarely happen. The reason is society has it that if they aren’t subtle, they might seem “slutty” or easy. Unfortunately this is how things are viewed. As for yourself, you have to practice congruency. Pheromones are an amplifier of who you are as a person. I’m sure the reason you’re doing this is to help your social life, just as many of us have done here. Also remember that your emotions will always project what you internally feel. If mones project something then something is going wrong, and instinctively, women will mentally disqualify you, because they don’t know what’s really going on with you. If you give us a little more details on what you want to accomplish first, we can probably try and help you out. There are too many factors out there to give you a “two sprays of this, one of that, and a drop of this” you have to tailor it for your goals, personality, etc. ---
**Author:** ![unknown0001](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/unknown0001/32/559_2.png) [@unknown0001](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/unknown0001)\ **Post date:** [May 15, 2010, 6:10pm UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/up-and-down-results/38617/9 "2010-05-15T18:10:46Z")
I get blatant hits all the time! Look over my posts. The 1st time I sprayed 2 sprays of TUTH and was walking outside in NYC after seeing a Bwy show…This women 34 maybe, smoooking Hot with two business men got a whiff and stared at me like I was a box of bon bons! ---
**Author:** ![P51Mustang](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/p51mustang/32/1266_2.png) [@P51Mustang](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/P51Mustang)\ **Post date:** [May 15, 2010, 6:38pm UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/up-and-down-results/38617/10 "2010-05-15T18:38:36Z")
How long have you been at the game? ---
**Author:** ![mr\_clavet](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d2c977/32.png) [@mr\_clavet](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/mr_clavet)\ **Post date:** [May 15, 2010, 6:42pm UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/up-and-down-results/38617/11 "2010-05-15T18:42:43Z")
> [@happytappin](#): > > I get blatant hits all the time! Look over my posts. The 1st time I sprayed 2 sprays of TUTH and was walking outside in NYC after seeing a Bwy show…This women 34 maybe, smoooking Hot with two business men got a whiff and stared at me like I was a box of bon bons! Ahah. That’s why i’m kind of frustrated. 'Cause I’ve got some of those blatant hits once. And for some reason, the same mix haven’t work since that night. > [@P51Mustang](#): > > If you give us a little more details on what you want to accomplish first, we can probably try and help you out. There are too many factors out there to give you a “two sprays of this, one of that, and a drop of this” you have to tailor it for your goals, personality, etc. Well my first goal is to help my game with girls. I’m usually able to play a nice game and makeout once in a while. I tought pheromones could make a tiny difference and improve my game a little. As for my personnality, I’m not shy, but I’m not the most extraverted. I think I’m pretty alpha, even though I don’t take a lot of place. But when I do talk, poeple listen to me, 'cause I won’t talk for no reason. Don’t know if it’s enough to help you helping me. I’m 19 by the way. ---
**Author:** ![hercs63](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/8c91f0/32.png) [@hercs63](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/hercs63)\ **Post date:** [May 15, 2010, 6:51pm UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/up-and-down-results/38617/12 "2010-05-15T18:51:34Z")
You will notice more obvious hits when your in a club/bar as girls tend to chat to you rather than say in the streets. For the past few months that I have been using AD Products, I 've had success with females dancing & chatting with me without fail, in fact, even my friend who I go out with regularly can’t believe the attention I get now , week in, week out, when i first told him I use Phermones & he should try it,do u know wot, he laughed & took the piss, that was a while back & now when he see’s me spray myself before I go out, he ain’t laughing anymore… A few weeks back, I put on 2xAmmo, 2xIS & 1xA314, went out as usual, didn’t think anything of it, didn’t recognise any hits all night, however my mate said that girl is checking me out, but when I turned round to see, I didn’t see it, so wasn’t sure he was joking or the girl was shy once I caught her out looking, anyway, went to this club, about 70% packed, just dancing with mate, then all of a sudden,a girl was rubbing herself behind me & then another girl just appeared out of nowhere and dancing/rubbing herself in front of me, so I was literally sandwiched, when other people saw whats going on the dance floor became empty with just me & 2 girls, so when I saw my friends face who was looking at me was a picture. What I notice about 'mones is the saying ‘less is more’ , in fact, once I spray myself with mones before I go out, I forget about it all night & don’t realise I have it on until girls starts to pay more attention to me more than usual. Also, when I do go out, I have a neutral expectation about hits whether they happen or not, but somehow AD products have not let me down.so far. ---
**Author:** ![P51Mustang](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/p51mustang/32/1266_2.png) [@P51Mustang](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/P51Mustang)\ **Post date:** [May 15, 2010, 6:52pm UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/up-and-down-results/38617/13 "2010-05-15T18:52:28Z")
happytappin is old(er) lol. so you might not need too much TUTH, but the more you do the more older women you will attract. Unless that’s what you’re looking for then I wouldn’t OD on that. The best blatant hits I’ve gotten from women is just with AMMO covered with my cologne. Find your sweet spot there and go from there. I’ve noticed the spray to the chest has been one of the best one for me, I think it diffuses a lot better there for some reason. What I do is 1 Spray to chest, 1 to Wrist, rubbed together then side of my neck. I cover it up with my cologne (I’ve got nothing but great compliments on it.) Depends how long i’ll be out, but I’ll either carry an AMMO to-go or a TUTH, usually that’s my closer for the night. Try some IS by your neck, it might help uplift your mood a little bit, help bring out the characteristics that you know are there but not necessarily showing. ---
**Author:** ![mr\_clavet](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d2c977/32.png) [@mr\_clavet](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/mr_clavet)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2010, 7:12am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/up-and-down-results/38617/14 "2010-05-16T07:12:51Z")
All right. Tonight I tried 2 shots of [Ammo](https://a314.com/product/ammo/) to the neck, and I hanged out with a bunch of friends. There was 4 girls and 5 guys. One girl was always trying to touch me, but she’s always like that, no difference there. I tried to stay away since her boyfriend was there and he doesn’t know me and her had sex once, while he was sleeping in the other room. Lol. Anyways, tonight was just a normal night. Nothing unusual. I’m still wondering if i’m doing something wrong. I’m thinking of ordering some IS since I’m pretty introverted. Maybe IS is the missing part of the puzzle. ---
**Author:** ![unknown0001](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/unknown0001/32/559_2.png) [@unknown0001](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/unknown0001)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2010, 7:19am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/up-and-down-results/38617/15 "2010-05-16T07:19:14Z")
> [@P51Mustang](#): > > How long have you been at the game? Well, to be fair. I wasn’t gaming. i was just walking. She got a whiff and BAM…but frankly I have gotten laid without phermones. BUt I’d say Ive dabbled for a few years but only go out, once every month or so. I’m finding mones makes it much easier when i do. Still every times I wear them, I get what I think are blatant hits. tonight the hits were self effects mostly. look at my IG + IS + IH post ---
**Author:** ![RADMAN513](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/radman513/32/364_2.png) [@RADMAN513](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/RADMAN513)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2010, 8:10am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/up-and-down-results/38617/16 "2010-05-16T08:10:33Z")
OK here’s the deal, the mones are as consistent as you are. By your own description your game is ok but you use terms like “Usually” and “once in a while” this implies inconsistency, “Think” and “Pretty alpha” indicates a lack of certainty. Then there’s the part about people listening when you talk because you won’t talk for no reason. You have some good products, too many for your situation imo. The mones work when you do. Basically when you’re running a tight game, mones will give you say a 10% boost or advantage. It’ll help get those girls that might be a little harder to game, or help your game run a little smoother than it would without. In my opinion your best bet is to pick up rules of the game and take the 30 day challenge…even if you think your game is “ok” now, empty the cup before you refill it. While doing that, just take two shots of Ammo a day when you go out. Ammo is the best all around product, it’s simple and easy to be congruent with. It will work WITH your efforts to actually bring your game to a level where you can build attraction consistently. As a side benefit you’ll get practice at looking for and recognizing IOI’s (hits). THEN you can start playing around with the other products and will actually notice how the hits can be different depending on what product you’re using. ---
**Author:** ![MisterMagik](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/mistermagik/32/2360_2.png) [@MisterMagik](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/MisterMagik)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2010, 8:28am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/up-and-down-results/38617/17 "2010-05-16T08:28:13Z")
> [@RADMAN513](#): > > OK here’s the deal, the mones are as consistent as you are. By your own description your game is ok but you use terms like “Usually” and “once in a while” this implies inconsistency, “Think” and “Pretty alpha” indicates a lack of certainty. Then there’s the part about people listening when you talk because you won’t talk for no reason. > > You have some good products, too many for your situation imo. The mones work when you do. Basically when you’re running a tight game, mones will give you say a 10% boost or advantage. It’ll help get those girls that might be a little harder to game, or help your game run a little smoother than it would without. > > In my opinion your best bet is to pick up rules of the game and take the 30 day challenge…even if you think your game is “ok” now, empty the cup before you refill it. While doing that, just take two shots of Ammo a day when you go out. Ammo is the best all around product, it’s simple and easy to be congruent with. It will work WITH your efforts to actually bring your game to a level where you can build attraction consistently. As a side benefit you’ll get practice at looking for and recognizing IOI’s (hits). THEN you can start playing around with the other products and will actually notice how the hits can be different depending on what product you’re using. Thank you. I couldn’t quite put what you just said into words. But thank you. ---
**Author:** ![mr\_clavet](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d2c977/32.png) [@mr\_clavet](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/mr_clavet)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2010, 8:48am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/up-and-down-results/38617/18 "2010-05-16T08:48:11Z")
> [@RADMAN513](#): > > OK here’s the deal, the mones are as consistent as you are. By your own description your game is ok but you use terms like “Usually” and “once in a while” this implies inconsistency, “Think” and “Pretty alpha” indicates a lack of certainty. Then there’s the part about people listening when you talk because you won’t talk for no reason. > > You have some good products, too many for your situation imo. The mones work when you do. Basically when you’re running a tight game, mones will give you say a 10% boost or advantage. It’ll help get those girls that might be a little harder to game, or help your game run a little smoother than it would without. > > In my opinion your best bet is to pick up rules of the game and take the 30 day challenge…even if you think your game is “ok” now, empty the cup before you refill it. While doing that, just take two shots of Ammo a day when you go out. Ammo is the best all around product, it’s simple and easy to be congruent with. It will work WITH your efforts to actually bring your game to a level where you can build attraction consistently. As a side benefit you’ll get practice at looking for and recognizing IOI’s (hits). THEN you can start playing around with the other products and will actually notice how the hits can be different depending on what product you’re using. All right, I’ll work on my game. I’ve already done the 30 day challenge, but I didn’t do half the missions… Didn’t have the guts to do most of them. I’m not sure I would now either. I know a lot of stuff… Routines, body language, NLP, open-loops, story-telling, cold-reading… It goes on and on and on. But on the field I can’t put everything together as easely as I would want to. I know I should go on the field, do those f$%&\* missions and it would all come out naturally when I’ll get use to it. But my fear of rejections allows me to game only girls that gave me strong IOI’s… Anyways, that’s exactly the type of answer I was looking for. Thanks! ---
**Author:** ![RADMAN513](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/radman513/32/364_2.png) [@RADMAN513](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/RADMAN513)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2010, 9:03am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/up-and-down-results/38617/19 "2010-05-16T09:03:37Z")
Here’s some stuff to think on that I share with guys that helps some of them get over approach anxiety and fear of rejection. The population of the planet is over 6 BILLION people, Women are actually the majority. That means there’s well over 3 Billion women in the world. How fucking bad can it be if this one rejects you? The phrase “there’s plenty of fish in the sea” really is true in this case. So relax and have fun with it, being with a woman should fun and enjoyable, not too much work. If she doesn’t like your game, then chalk it up as a learning experience, there’s still 3 billion -1 women for you try for that will get your improved and modified game. ---
**Author:** ![P51Mustang](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/p51mustang/32/1266_2.png) [@P51Mustang](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/P51Mustang)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2010, 9:08am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/up-and-down-results/38617/20 "2010-05-16T09:08:58Z")
Nobody, however attractive they are, will always get a girl on the spot every time. Its dealing with the situations that come up that will help you out in the long run. I’ve never done the 30 day challenge but a good friend of mine made me go and talk to every single girl possible and try to strike up a conversation. No pickup lines, whatever just came to my mind at the time. The more I look at it today the more I see how valuable that was, you weren’t relying on a pre-set idea and you were just going with how you were feeling that night, it helped me be congruent in everything I did. Nothing ever happens overnight too, you just gotta keep working at it. For me personally mones have taken my nights out to a whole new level. As great as any of the products may be, I’ve still seen rejections, I’ve still seen letdowns, but with the way I have experienced it in the past, I’ve cut my losses and moved on to the next one with sometimes amazing results, and some not so amazing. But the key to game, and pheromones, is knowing when it’s not working out and quickly thinking on your feet to accomplish your ultimate goal, which is to show a female how good you really are, how much you can offer to the table. That being said, the more you try it, the more you will learn, and who cares if you get shot down, does it suck? Yes. Does it sometimes make you feel embarrased in front of your boys/strangers? Yes. Does it really matter in the end when you picked up a lot of knowledge? No. Evaluate each situations and see what you can improve on from that interaction. With game and pickup, it’s so hard to master anything, even they have trouble picking everyone up. I hope for the best you keep posting and asking questions when it comes to these things. I’ve only been testing out Pheromones for a few months, but I’ve been playing the game for quite a while and it’s something I’ve grown very familiar with. Good luck, any specific questions, feel free to PM me [Next page](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/up-and-down-results/38617.md?page=2)