# We've even toyed with silicon based pheromones **URL:** \ **Category:** Men's Pheromone Advice & Field Reports\ **Created:** [May 3, 2006, 1:36am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/weve-even-toyed-with-silicon-based-pheromones/331 "2006-05-03T01:36:50Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 13\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![tacitus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/6a8cbe/32.png) [@tacitus](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/tacitus)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2006, 1:36am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/weve-even-toyed-with-silicon-based-pheromones/331/1 "2006-05-03T01:36:50Z")
Now THATS far out past left field somewhere… The wierdest substitutions were by Shulgin when he synthesized phenyethylamines… he tried making deutero (as in 1st isotope of hydrogen) and seleno substituted “entheogens”… said that the selenium analog tasted vile… When do we get to try the Patriotism [pheromone](https://a314.com/shop/) ? ---
**Author:** ![MHarris](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/mharris/32/2107_2.png) [@MHarris](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/MHarris)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2006, 7:16am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/weve-even-toyed-with-silicon-based-pheromones/331/2 "2006-05-03T07:16:53Z")
I meant as a diluent, but yes, THAT is way out in the left field! I’m sure we’ll be heading further further “left field” as time progresses. Some of the current putatives are more in the Shulgin-esque realm, and we’re soon going to exhaust the supply of known naturally occuring [putative pheromones](https://pheromonelabs.com/product-category/advanced-pheromones/putative-pheromones/) for testing. ---
**Author:** ![examine](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/examine/32/1665_2.png) [@examine](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/examine)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2006, 7:38am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/weve-even-toyed-with-silicon-based-pheromones/331/3 "2006-05-03T07:38:06Z")
good start with chocolate. …it brings women to their knees. =P ---
**Author:** ![MHarris](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/mharris/32/2107_2.png) [@MHarris](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/MHarris)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2006, 7:40am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/weve-even-toyed-with-silicon-based-pheromones/331/4 "2006-05-03T07:40:01Z")
> [@examine](#): > > good start with chocolate. > > …it brings women to their knees. =P Or Chocamine. ---
**Author:** ![examine](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/examine/32/1665_2.png) [@examine](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/examine)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2006, 7:41am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/weve-even-toyed-with-silicon-based-pheromones/331/5 "2006-05-03T07:41:49Z")
this is true. ---
**Author:** ![catlord17](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f9ae1b/32.png) [@catlord17](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/catlord17)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2006, 6:06am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/weve-even-toyed-with-silicon-based-pheromones/331/6 "2006-05-09T06:06:31Z")
Does chocolate affect the production of PEA in the brain? I see they have oxytocin sprays now, how long till we have a “falling in love” blend of oxy + PEA? lol ---
**Author:** ![tacitus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/6a8cbe/32.png) [@tacitus](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/tacitus)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2006, 12:53pm UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/weve-even-toyed-with-silicon-based-pheromones/331/7 "2006-05-09T12:53:42Z")
Oxytocin goes up your nose as a spray The physical structure of oxytocin is protein like so it isn’t built for evaporation… it needs to be injected or insufflated (snorted) in a water carrier… as an airborne agent, not too likely. Real oxytocin taken nasally is a potent hormone… if you dose it correctly you feel like you’ve just had fantastic sex, it IS the afterglow hormone, if you overdose it you will feel cranked and miserable… the brain habituates to it rapidly and that may explain one of the parameters of sex addiction… an indirect form of oxytocin addction… one suspects that the Mystery Method guys and the other PUAs and the girls that frequent their venues are all unwitting oxytocin junkies. They’ve all converged on behaviors that trick the pituitary gland into dumping oxytocin into the bloodstream.. that then causes a dopamine cascade in the medial hypothalamus, which then causes intense, albeit brief, sensations of pleasure… Notice that at no point does the oxytocin migrate to the skin or interchange between the parties… it is fundamentally a tight loop where the brain is talking to itself chemically… similar to oxytocin is the hormone _vasopressin_ , also made by the pituitary gland which appears to be a pre-orgasmic sexual enhancer… vasopressin makes the orgasm deeper, longer, and more profound, while oxytocin actually reduces the intensity of the orgasm (the brain assumes it has just been there and done that)… In my experience, that absolute best orgasms I’ve had involved nasal vasopressin and [pheromones](https://pheromonelabs.com/shop/) in combination… caveat, the vasopressin has to go in immediately before sex, and don’t OD on it either or dare take any other blood pressure elevating drug or you could have a hypertension episode…having said that, a good solid none, rone, and alpha nol blend and a single shot of vasopressin all right before sex will allow your brain to release all the oxytocin it can possible handle… ---
**Author:** ![Rbt](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/rbt/32/2066_2.png) [@Rbt](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/Rbt)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2006, 10:14pm UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/weve-even-toyed-with-silicon-based-pheromones/331/8 "2006-05-09T22:14:37Z")
I can just see someone shoving a spray bottle up their girl’s nose just as she’s getting in the mood… That might not go over too well… 😛 ---
**Author:** ![mbakron](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/8dc957/32.png) [@mbakron](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/mbakron)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2006, 3:43am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/weve-even-toyed-with-silicon-based-pheromones/331/9 "2006-07-21T03:43:21Z")
Guys, don’t bother with silicon based pheromones. I’m a chemist who knows a little about the pharmaceutical industry. The best thing you can do to come up with new pharmaceuticals is to replace an OH group, or sometimes a strategic hydrogen atom, with Fluorine. One potential advantage to this would be that an alcohol replaced by fluorine cannot be oxidized to a ketone… potentially preventing some of your -ol pheromones from being converted into -one pheromones. There’s a number of other possibilities with fluorine, but more than most here care to know about. If you want to know more, send a PM. ---
**Author:** ![Scottie2Hottie](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/scottie2hottie/32/628_2.png) [@Scottie2Hottie](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/Scottie2Hottie)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2006, 9:26pm UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/weve-even-toyed-with-silicon-based-pheromones/331/10 "2006-07-21T21:26:21Z")
Welcome to the forum! Nice to have you here, as I’m sure you could offer some useful contributions…to help educate and enlighten. > [@mbakron](#): > > One potential advantage to this would be that an alcohol replaced by fluorine cannot be oxidized to a ketone… potentially preventing some of your -ol pheromones from being converted into -one pheromones. Now this sounds very interesting, indeed. ---
**Author:** ![tacitus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/6a8cbe/32.png) [@tacitus](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/tacitus)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2006, 3:17am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/weve-even-toyed-with-silicon-based-pheromones/331/11 "2006-07-22T03:17:41Z")
We did have a little private chat about halogen substitutions. Shulgin observed that when he substituted fluorine in phenyethylamines, they were almost without action, but as he went down the table from chlorine through iodine the PEAs became increasingly intense. He did some interesting thio substitutions as well, and an amine group might be kind of effective…:o > [@mbakron](#): > > Guys, don’t bother with silicon based pheromones. I’m a chemist who knows a little about the pharmaceutical industry. The best thing you can do to come up with new pharmaceuticals is to replace an OH group, or sometimes a strategic hydrogen atom, with Fluorine. > > One potential advantage to this would be that an alcohol replaced by fluorine cannot be oxidized to a ketone… potentially preventing some of your -ol pheromones from being converted into -one pheromones. > > There’s a number of other possibilities with fluorine, but more than most here care to know about. If you want to know more, send a PM. ---
**Author:** ![mbakron](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/8dc957/32.png) [@mbakron](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/mbakron)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2006, 4:13am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/weve-even-toyed-with-silicon-based-pheromones/331/12 "2006-07-22T04:13:13Z")
> [@tacitus](#): > > We did have a little private chat about halogen substitutions. Shulgin observed that when he substituted fluorine in phenyethylamines, they were almost without action, but as he went down the table from chlorine through iodine the PEAs became increasingly intense. He did some interesting thio substitutions as well, and an amine group might be kind of effective…:o Absolutely! All of those are great ideas. However, in biological systems, substituting in one molecule can have a totally different effect from that of another molecule. You just have to try it. Pharmaceutical companies screen thousands of similar molecules, often differing by just one atom. Usually, a few show promise, but most do nothing. This would work well for your research, though. Basically, throw a bunch of known, similar pheromones in a pot, and selectively alter one part that all of those molecules have in common. Test the mixture and see what happens. If it does nothing, throw it out, and go on to modifying another part. If it does something, then go back, modify each one individually, and figure out which ones work! Chemists call this “combinatorial” synthesis. Traditional chemists hate it, but pharmaceutical companies love it. It’s responsible for most modern medicines. That being said, the combinatorial, or “shotgun,” approach still needs chemists to suggest what is worth trying. You still need to point the shotgun at the target! See? We’re good for something! ---
**Author:** ![mbakron](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/8dc957/32.png) [@mbakron](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/mbakron)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2006, 4:39am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/weve-even-toyed-with-silicon-based-pheromones/331/13 "2006-07-22T04:39:01Z")
I’d also be interested in difluorinating, (or otherwise disubstituting,) the ketone of -none. The product might act like the ketone, but it could just as easily act like A-nol or B-nol… or BOTH! (or all three?)😮 I have tons of other ideas, but I need to control myself. I can’t wait for my first order to arrive. I’ve seen so many BS ads for pheromones, but this place approaches it in a logical, scientific manner. If I hadn’t come across this site, I’d have still considered 'mones to be “snake oil.”