# Younger = Less; Older = More; and it just hit me... **URL:** \ **Category:** Men's Pheromone Advice & Field Reports\ **Created:** [December 6, 2009, 8:02am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/younger-less-older-more-and-it-just-hit-me/34660 "2009-12-06T08:02:01Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![catlord17](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f9ae1b/32.png) [@catlord17](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/catlord17)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2009, 8:02am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/younger-less-older-more-and-it-just-hit-me/34660/1 "2009-12-06T08:02:01Z")
It just hit me that older women prefer more androstenone and younger women prefer less. My tests and calculations have been showing that it is often true or mixes containing androstenone too. And this explains cougars! When does a man have the strongest [pheromone](https://pheromonelabs.com/shop/) signature with androstenone production? Around 18, IIRC. When does it start falling off? As he gets older. And when a woman is younger, she prefers less androstenone… and more and more as she ages. Surely not the whole ball of wax, but definitely this would be a factor. Women reach their sexual peak in their early to mid thirties, don’t they? Wouldn’t this indicate that the males in their sexual peak at around 18 would be (sans society’s effects) the ones pairing up with women in their sexual peak? And when it comes to men and younger women, the same thing applies… older men have less androstenone, and therefore would tend to be more attractive to younger women pheromonally than guys their own age, if we remove the effect society has had on them in terms of shaping their thinking about what age is “appropriate” to mate with. Meanwhile, younger women are at the peak of their production of Eau d’First Heat, which I theorize is going to be more attractive to a man than the copulins signature of an older woman most of the time. What we have here, if my idea is right, is a situation where older women (who would have lived long enough to have enough experience to not just survive, but know how to handle themselves) are the ones who would have been getting the most virile male’s sperm, and younger women would be getting the sperm of the men who, themselves, had lived long enough to prove not just survivability, but also long enough to settle down and become a provider. Nature seems to want us to be cross-breeding this way, by the looks of it… This revelation came to me after discovering that one of my younger test subjects seems to respond best to just one spray of Panty Scorcher. That really surprised me, because most women seem to respond in the 2-3-4 range. But she’s only 23. This particular girl also responds best to a single spray of TUTH. ---
**Author:** ![Olfact\_Amorous](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/olfact_amorous/32/434_2.png) [@Olfact\_Amorous](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/Olfact_Amorous)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2009, 3:12pm UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/younger-less-older-more-and-it-just-hit-me/34660/2 "2009-12-06T15:12:34Z")
Well on top of that to add if a guy is well into their 40’s 50’s ish you could probably exceeding amounts of none around the ladies in the older range. The only problem I find with that prospect is if men in the older category could handle your signature and what adverse effects it may have on younger men. I guess you can say I’m trying to discern if the level of none you use equates directly with age or sort of a “pick me up” so that it wouldn’t have any apparent bad effects since it may just show you as younger more testosterone filled individual. OR on the flip side is the level of none usage absolute which spell catastrophic reactions with heightened use of none as there could be varying demographics of age in the viscinity. Sorry for the long ramble I’m just curious XD. The idea you touched upon with cross breeding really makes sense to me too. ---
**Author:** ![M\_M](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9fc29f/32.png) [@M\_M](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/M_M)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2009, 4:09pm UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/younger-less-older-more-and-it-just-hit-me/34660/3 "2009-12-06T16:09:50Z")
It makes perfect sense, and tis a good rule to follow, BUT … there is always THAT exception. I’ve seen young one’s flip for heavy -none, and I’ve seen old one’s flip for heavy -none. Still … if we say ‘the average’ … this could be correct! ---
**Author:** ![Hyper](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/hyper/32/1326_2.png) [@Hyper](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/Hyper)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2009, 4:51pm UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/younger-less-older-more-and-it-just-hit-me/34660/4 "2009-12-06T16:51:16Z")
This would mean i should be very economical with TUTH, A314 and [Ammo](https://a314.com/product/ammo/) when i want to attract the younger women?? ---
**Author:** ![Olfact\_Amorous](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/olfact_amorous/32/434_2.png) [@Olfact\_Amorous](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/Olfact_Amorous)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2009, 4:58pm UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/younger-less-older-more-and-it-just-hit-me/34660/5 "2009-12-06T16:58:40Z")
Latinas and Black girls in general can handle higher none lvls overall IME. But yeah you can take it easy on the whole none aspect with younger girls. I find a touch of a none with a-nol or other social mones works better for me than higher none most of the time. And I say that with skepticism because I feel I have more of a rone vibe than a none vibe which made me thought I could wear heavier none. A314 is okay as long as you steer it properly but i think less none in terms of TUTH and ammo is better. I only say that because most of the women I’m around when I go out are anywhere from 17-23 and usually less is better. ---
**Author:** ![mikotorocks714](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/mikotorocks714/32/1509_2.png) [@mikotorocks714](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/mikotorocks714)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2009, 8:03pm UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/younger-less-older-more-and-it-just-hit-me/34660/6 "2009-12-06T20:03:10Z")
Yes, I agree. I think that there’s exceptions as well. I highly think that girls who are into big buff jerks or jocks prefer high -none levels and that’s why they go for those types of guys where as girls who are into metrosexual men (or men who are “nicer” may prefer more Androstenol type of men.) ---
**Author:** ![djandarial](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/djandarial/32/1667_2.png) [@djandarial](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/djandarial)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2009, 8:30pm UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/younger-less-older-more-and-it-just-hit-me/34660/7 "2009-12-06T20:30:08Z")
I agree with M&M Would love to see Xiphoid comment on this ---
**Author:** ![Xiphoid](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/xiphoid/32/1852_2.png) [@Xiphoid](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/Xiphoid)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2009, 8:31pm UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/younger-less-older-more-and-it-just-hit-me/34660/8 "2009-12-06T20:31:32Z")
> [@catlord17](#): > > When does a man have the strongest pheromone signature with androstenone production? Around 18, IIRC. When does it start falling off? As he gets older. And when a woman is younger, she prefers less androstenone… and more and more as she ages. Surely not the whole ball of wax, but definitely this would be a factor. Women reach their sexual peak in their early to mid thirties, don’t they? Wouldn’t this indicate that the males in their sexual peak at around 18 would be (sans society’s effects) the ones pairing up with women in their sexual peak? It makes sense to me 🙂 Womens fertility is the strongest when they are younger so they don’t have to seek out “very fertile” mates which a high -none signature would signal…a lesser none signal would suffice. As women age their fertility rapidly decreases, in particular once they hit 30. At 35 a womans fertility levels are only 50% of those of a woman in her 20’s, and the decline is even more rapid in the late 30’s. A female in her mid-to-late 30’s would likely be more attracted to a phero signature with high levels of -none as mating with such a man would maximize the chances of conception. If you think about it… most women in their 20’s tend to go for guys a bit older & we say it’s because “guys our age are soo immature”…Once we hit the 30’s we are suddenly “not so fuzzed” & often quite happily date younger guys using the “age doesn’t really matter” excuse 🙄 ---
**Author:** ![djandarial](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/djandarial/32/1667_2.png) [@djandarial](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/djandarial)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2009, 8:34pm UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/younger-less-older-more-and-it-just-hit-me/34660/9 "2009-12-06T20:34:30Z")
older -none, younger -rone in my research is most effective in visible and spoken comments ---
**Author:** ![mikotorocks714](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/mikotorocks714/32/1509_2.png) [@mikotorocks714](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/mikotorocks714)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2009, 8:38pm UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/younger-less-older-more-and-it-just-hit-me/34660/10 "2009-12-06T20:38:42Z")
Androsterone with a touch of Alphanol I think is good. Just as in SOE, as I think the Alphanol adds a touch of youth while the Androsterone can add a mature vibe without the -none negatives. > [@djandarial](#): > > older -none, younger -rone > > in my research is most effective in visible and spoken comments ---
**Author:** ![tezza23](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/tezza23/32/1375_2.png) [@tezza23](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/tezza23)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2009, 12:47am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/younger-less-older-more-and-it-just-hit-me/34660/11 "2009-12-07T00:47:05Z")
> [@](#): > > Women reach their sexual peak in their early to mid thirties, don’t they? No, women are at their peak of fertility, and sexual peak, in their early twenties. As Xiphoid pointed out, in their thirties they are confident enough to express their sexuality without worrying what others think, that’s all. Older, established males are preferred by females in most species, simply because they’ve proven they can survive disease and predators. And older males prefer younger (more fertile) females. Thus, younger women will be attracted to older men (who produce less 'none) which is probably why they’re so none-sensitive. They are also able to get them, because they have genetically more to offer. Older females (and I’m not saying any woman in her thirties or later is “old”, but after her peak of fertility) must make do with the less genetically desirable, unproven males. Hence the preference for more 'none. ---
**Author:** ![tisha23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/53a042/32.png) [@tisha23](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/tisha23)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2009, 10:16am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/younger-less-older-more-and-it-just-hit-me/34660/12 "2009-12-07T10:16:51Z")
> [@catlord17](#): > > It just hit me that older women prefer more androstenone and younger women prefer less. My tests and calculations have been showing that it is often true or mixes containing androstenone too. And this explains cougars! > > When does a man have the strongest pheromone signature with androstenone production? Around 18, IIRC. When does it start falling off? As he gets older. And when a woman is younger, she prefers less androstenone… and more and more as she ages. Surely not the whole ball of wax, but definitely this would be a factor. Women reach their sexual peak in their early to mid thirties, don’t they? Wouldn’t this indicate that the males in their sexual peak at around 18 would be (sans society’s effects) the ones pairing up with women in their sexual peak? > > And when it comes to men and younger women, the same thing applies… older men have less androstenone, and therefore would tend to be more attractive to younger women pheromonally than guys their own age, if we remove the effect society has had on them in terms of shaping their thinking about what age is “appropriate” to mate with. Meanwhile, younger women are at the peak of their production of Eau d’First Heat, which I theorize is going to be more attractive to a man than the copulins signature of an older woman most of the time. > > What we have here, if my idea is right, is a situation where older women (who would have lived long enough to have enough experience to not just survive, but know how to handle themselves) are the ones who would have been getting the most virile male’s sperm, and younger women would be getting the sperm of the men who, themselves, had lived long enough to prove not just survivability, but also long enough to settle down and become a provider. > > Nature seems to want us to be cross-breeding this way, by the looks of it… > > This revelation came to me after discovering that one of my younger test subjects seems to respond best to just one spray of Panty Scorcher. That really surprised me, because most women seem to respond in the 2-3-4 range. But she’s only 23. This particular girl also responds best to a single spray of TUTH. Come on now CL I know this is something you had to know with your experience. We have been telling members this for years right here on the forum. Its Basic Pheromone theory. Tisha ---
**Author:** ![tezza23](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/tezza23/32/1375_2.png) [@tezza23](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/tezza23)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2009, 10:34am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/younger-less-older-more-and-it-just-hit-me/34660/13 "2009-12-07T10:34:32Z")
Well, it does make sense. Catlord mentioned calculations; if CL has actually managed to _measure_ how much 'none to use for an age group, that’s a big deal IMO. ---
**Author:** ![tisha23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/53a042/32.png) [@tisha23](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/tisha23)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2009, 11:43am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/younger-less-older-more-and-it-just-hit-me/34660/14 "2009-12-07T11:43:18Z")
> [@tezza23](#): > > Well, it does make sense. Catlord mentioned calculations; if CL has actually managed to _measure_ how much 'none to use for an age group, that’s a big deal IMO. I am not putting CL down or anything, I have known him and followed his posts since way back at LS and greatly value his insight. He is one of my favorite peeps in the phero world. I am just as surprised as he is that this just dawned on him though. I have no doubt in his ability to measure how much anone works for him. However we are all physically and chemically different so you can not measure this for others. Unfortunately they have to do the work and experiment for themselves. There is a range and many golden rules we have always considered and talked about in here though which is why his revelation surprised me. Young men under thirty generally need less anone because they naturally make more. To much doesn’t attract but repel. Older men after 30 generally begin to make more arone and there anone lessens so they need to use more to signal vitality. Older women attract to higher anone signatures on a men because it signals vitality. Younger women can become intimidated by the high anone signature especially if they are not sexually mature yet. Sexual maturity happens at all different ages in a person because its more of a mental condition then a chemical one. Women reach sexual maturity **chemically** when menstruation occurs the first time. Women peak hormonally in there early twenties because this is prime breeding time. Its all part of the natural order of [pheromones](https://a314.com/shop/). Men and women attract chemically to the strongest breeder just like in the animal kingdom. Tisha ---
**Author:** ![mikotorocks714](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/mikotorocks714/32/1509_2.png) [@mikotorocks714](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/mikotorocks714)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2009, 12:31pm UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/younger-less-older-more-and-it-just-hit-me/34660/15 "2009-12-07T12:31:19Z")
I agree with my dear Tish, EVERYONE is different. Just as every MX won’t be a success for everyone else. It just depends, many men can have the same -none range for young and older women while other men will vary. It just depends. > [@tisha23](#): > > I am not putting CL down or anything, I have known him and followed his posts since way back at LS and greatly value his insight. He is one of my favorite peeps in the phero world. I am just as surprised as he is that this just dawned on him though. > > I have no doubt in his ability to measure how much anone works for him. However we are all physically and chemically different so you can not measure this for others. Unfortunately they have to do the work and experiment for themselves. There is a range and many golden rules we have always considered and talked about in here though which is why his revelation surprised me. > > Young men under thirty generally need less anone because they naturally make more. To much doesn’t attract but repel. > > Older men after 30 generally begin to make more arone and there anone lessens so they need to use more to signal vitality. > > Older women attract to higher anone signatures on a men because it signals vitality. > > Younger women can become intimidated by the high anone signature especially if they are not sexually mature yet. Sexual maturity happens at all different ages in a person because its more of a mental condition then a chemical one. Women reach sexual maturity **chemically** when menstruation occurs the first time. Women peak hormonally in there early twenties because this is prime breeding time. > > Its all part of the natural order of pheromones. Men and women attract chemically to the strongest breeder just like in the animal kingdom. > > Tisha ---
**Author:** ![Mtnjim](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/mtnjim/32/2010_2.png) [@Mtnjim](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/Mtnjim)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2009, 1:45am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/younger-less-older-more-and-it-just-hit-me/34660/16 "2009-12-09T01:45:58Z")
When talking “sexual maturity”, we have to go back to the “dawn of time” when humans were evolving. Women reach their peak breeding condition at around the ages of 12-18. This was so the offspring would be grown and independent when the parents died off around 30-35. Advance 1 million years to today, and anything beyond that is “society” There is the thesis. Why don’t we approach the discussion from this angle and see where it goes??🙄 ---
**Author:** ![catlord17](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f9ae1b/32.png) [@catlord17](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/catlord17)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2009, 8:20am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/younger-less-older-more-and-it-just-hit-me/34660/17 "2009-12-09T08:20:26Z")
Tezza, I think I need to be clearer in what I was trying to communicate. What I was referring to with “mid thirties” was peak of female sexuality. As in, that’s when she is most desirous of sex. As in, the clock is ticking, girl, better reproduce yourself! Tisha, Of course I had figured that out previously, but I never saw the “cross breeding” aspect of it before. That is what struck me… that is what I was interested in sharing. And while I can definitely calculate for myself what the ideal amount of a pheromone is, I can also calculate it for anyone else. Otherwise I would not keep running into walls when I try to calculate things like a redhead mix. That’s also a big part of what makes my calculator so special. And it consistently tells me that when I am dealing with women in the range of 18 to 25 that they seem to prefer less androstenone on average. On average is a good thing to specify, which I didn’t earlier. I encounter women who respond well to the average amount of androstenone and those who respond to more or less, and likewise with androsterone. It seems to be that starting at around age 16, every 3-4 years a woman moves into a new category of optimal response to androstenone dosage in terms of erotic response. A rough estimate would be like this: 16-19: 2.5 mcg 20-23: 5.0 mcg 24-27: 7.5 mcg 28-31: 10 mcg 32-35: 12.5 mcg 36-39: 15 mcg 40-43: 17.5 mcg 44+: 20 mcg Obviously, it’s a rough estimate… maybe not as accurate at the high end. I would imagine the inverse to be somewhat close to true for androsterone, but I haven’t even begun testing that yet. I’d be interested in hearing how accurate you think my list here is. ---
**Author:** ![catlord17](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f9ae1b/32.png) [@catlord17](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/catlord17)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2009, 8:22am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/younger-less-older-more-and-it-just-hit-me/34660/18 "2009-12-09T08:22:51Z")
> [@Mtnjim](#): > > When talking “sexual maturity”, we have to go back to the “dawn of time” when humans were evolving. Women reach their peak breeding condition at around the ages of 12-18. This was so the offspring would be grown and independent when the parents died off around 30-35. Advance 1 million years to today, and anything beyond that is “society” > > There is the thesis. Why don’t we approach the discussion from this angle and see where it goes??🙄 I’m not sure how we would do that… care to explain a bit more? ---
**Author:** ![hardkandy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/b2d939/32.png) [@hardkandy](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/hardkandy)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2009, 8:52am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/younger-less-older-more-and-it-just-hit-me/34660/19 "2009-12-09T08:52:17Z")
> [@catlord17](#): > > It just hit me that older women prefer more androstenone and younger women prefer less. My tests and calculations have been showing that it is often true or mixes containing androstenone too. And this explains cougars! > > When does a man have the strongest pheromone signature with androstenone production? Around 18, IIRC. When does it start falling off? As he gets older. And when a woman is younger, she prefers less androstenone… and more and more as she ages. Surely not the whole ball of wax, but definitely this would be a factor. Women reach their sexual peak in their early to mid thirties, don’t they? Wouldn’t this indicate that the males in their sexual peak at around 18 would be (sans society’s effects) the ones pairing up with women in their sexual peak? > > And when it comes to men and younger women, the same thing applies… older men have less androstenone, and therefore would tend to be more attractive to younger women pheromonally than guys their own age, if we remove the effect society has had on them in terms of shaping their thinking about what age is “appropriate” to mate with. Meanwhile, younger women are at the peak of their production of Eau d’First Heat, which I theorize is going to be more attractive to a man than the copulins signature of an older woman most of the time. > > What we have here, if my idea is right, is a situation where older women (who would have lived long enough to have enough experience to not just survive, but know how to handle themselves) are the ones who would have been getting the most virile male’s sperm, and younger women would be getting the sperm of the men who, themselves, had lived long enough to prove not just survivability, but also long enough to settle down and become a provider. > > Nature seems to want us to be cross-breeding this way, by the looks of it… > > This revelation came to me after discovering that one of my younger test subjects seems to respond best to just one spray of Panty Scorcher. That really surprised me, because most women seem to respond in the 2-3-4 range. But she’s only 23. This particular girl also responds best to a single spray of TUTH. Yeah man, that is a little bit of a conundrum isnt it? Although i do like your thinking outside the box style in regards to your post. Personally id go a cougar over a dumb young girl any day lol ---
**Author:** ![tezza23](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/pheromonetalk.com/tezza23/32/1375_2.png) [@tezza23](https://pheromonetalk.com/u/tezza23)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2009, 10:01am UTC](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/younger-less-older-more-and-it-just-hit-me/34660/20 "2009-12-09T10:01:05Z")
> [@](#): > > Women reach their peak breeding condition at around the ages of 12-18. This was so the offspring would be grown and independent when the parents died off around 30-35. Advance 1 million years to today, and anything beyond that is “society” Actually women reach their peak for childbearing at (IIRC) 23. Generally, in the range 18-28 is best. The main reason that the **average** age of death is so low in primitive cultures is that infant mortality is high, and the environment is dangerous. (For example, the murder rate in stone-age societies is on the order of 20-25 percent!) A healthy individual who managed to avoid getting killed would live as long as a modern person, if not longer. [Next page](https://pheromonetalk.com/t/younger-less-older-more-and-it-just-hit-me/34660.md?page=2)