Nah, I’m not offended.
Well don’t feel too bad, cause if you end up being depressed because of me. It’s not my fault lol
P.S: maybe you should drop it, you’re stirring up trouble for all that I know 
I meant that with love of course 
I was painfully shy growing up, and your typical “nice” guy that never seemed to have the success with women that I desperately craved.
I am still a hell of a nice guy But back then I was too nice. Agreed with everything a girl said, did anything they wanted me to do - in short, i was boring and no challenge at all. That isn’t attractive.
I wish I’d read PUA stuff when I was 18 - not as a means to “trick” girls, but to understand the theory behind why not being a pushover works.
You can use knowledge sensibly and responsibly. You can improve yourself confidence and understanding wise and remain a nice person. I’ve just spent an hour reading a journal on here by someone who is obviously not looking to dupe anyone, but is clearly improving their life through a little more understanding of “Game” and pheromone use. More power to them.
There are always going to be people who are more “self serving” with any power they attain. There will be guys that use PUA stuff to rack up as many notches on their bedpost as they can - and there will be people who buy pheromones hoping to do the same thing.
And then there are others who simply want to enhance their overall quality of interaction at all levels for the betterment of all involved.
As far as someone loving the pheromones rather than me? Again - I’m the same guy I was before I wore A314. But there’s nothing wrong with putting your best foot forward so your foot’s in the door long enough for people to notice the things that are really attractive about you.
I’ve been in the PUA community for over a year now and I understand where you’re coming from. These PUA’s take it too far, they can’t even speak english or act normal in a social gathering. For example: “hey dude let’s go sargin” and I’m thinking wtf? Before PUA existed, we usually say “hey dude let’s hang out or let’s meet up for a drink”. I hate how they give a women a rating like “10s, 9s, 8s, 6s”, they view women as objects and not people. The word “hot” is what I prefer to say rather than a number. I meet up with these guys and all that wanna talk about is “pick up” or “game”, I go out to have a fun time and all they wanna do is talk about bullshit. “Dude that guy hovering around those girls, it’s so embarassing” or “we have no value right now” was something this PUA said that kinda pissed me off and he himself did not do a single approach the whole night, all he did was talk nonsense. I had to let some of that off my chest, I’m done ranting now.
Sounds like I hate PUAs? I actually do, there are a few guys I met that I became good friends with, it’s a rare occasion though.
Oh lordy. Don’t be so convinced that women are using pheromones to attract their soulmates. A lot of the women would like enhance their relationships AND their sexual experiences. There are a lot of single women here and a lot of women who seem to be really sexually liberated and explorative. As a woman, it takes no great talent to find someone willing to screw you..but when you find GOOD Quality sex, you want explore and expand all possibilities. One night-stands are generally fumbly, unsatisfactory ruttings–mediocre at best. You can’t imagine using mones for any other reason then getting a laid by random chicks in a club… I CAN’T imagine spending good money on pheros to get a 1-nighter with some soused guy at a club. Many guys are willing to invest a fortune for this, good for them.
I want pheromones to make the sex more firery, animalistic, unrestrained, to intensify…more POW for my POP. Some women want to use them, just for the fun of getting more attention, some want to intensify their loving relationships and some women just like to drive guys nuts.
There is a world outside your penis. You just have to open the window and look around for it.
omg
i think i just found a new signature!
lol
I’m not proposing that as my own theory so much as I mean to point out that there are threads which detail such changes, and even if you do not believe them, there are others who may look at them and think “Pheromones will change me.” To someone who has little experience and doesn’t know the ins and outs of pheromones, that can be unnerving and even scary.
That feels a little harsh, though I don’t think you meant it quite as strongly as it sounds. I’m just trying to point towards facts that have fueled both mine and others’ discomfort.
Not all of us have such solid relationships and aren’t really able to observe the effects pheromones may have on a long term relationship. When someone has had little luck in the love department and decides to give pheromones a go, and all of a sudden someone wonderful comes along, many people’s first thought will be to wonder who exactly this person is in love with. Is it me or is it me doused in CTTM2 and a dash of androstenone? When you’ve been using pheromones for a long period of time, they become second nature, like the haircuts and other enhancements that have been mentioned. However, to a newcomer, pheromones are magic chemicals with seemingly inane rules and suggestions. Maybe you didn’t have a problem, but multiple friends I’ve told about pheromones have had concerns about this right off the bat. It just seems to be a necessary thought process for some people.
I definitely believe that human beings are far more than primal, instinctive beings. Culture, intelligence, conscience, and the soul make us extraordinary and complex. However, there is a lower, more primal nature to humans as animals. I don’t necessarily believe that it can override the others in any major way, but it is there and when you’ve seen a boar go after a tree smeared with musk, it would be silly not to wonder what effects they can have on humans, even if they are far more subtle. It takes years of experience to even begin to understand how they work on ourselves and those around us, and not all of us have that experience.
Haha!
But when I open the window, I only see high-altitude aircraft and occasionally a low-flying satellite. The air is unbreathable and it scares me.
But I jest.
Vespero,
your absolutely correct,
i did not mean it to sound harsh.
i apologise in advance for the way i come off sometimes.
i respect your perspective.
Not a problem. I usually assume people mean the best by what they say unless ill will is obvious. Your comment didn’t bother me so much as it made me wonder if I had stated my perspective clearly.
Don’t worry about it. You’re awesome, and you contribute far more laughs and good advice than occasionally harsh-sounding retorts.
Ditto.
It’s funny what this thread has morphed into. I don’t think one’s only interest in pheros should be to get laid. I’m still a newbie, but what I have learned is that I can use pheros to increase my attractiveness to others, mainly to men. But I’ve also found that using pheros has helped me get along better with women too. The pheros haven’t changed my personality at all. They just give me that extra boost I need to communicate more effectively and satisfactorily with others. Besides, there’s so much more to attraction than one’s pheromone signature. There have to be common interests and personality compatibility. Shared beliefs and values. Pheros don’t cause these things to happen. They just make the attraction easier to attain.
Having been absent for a while, I have noticed a shift in the atmosphere in the male forum and lounge.. I’m not too worried about this, these things always go in waves, like the stock market, sometimes there is a boom, other times a bust. I just skip the posts that arent of value to me.
I have read some PUA material through a female bisexual poster on another forum and there is some good, some bad and some ugly in it. Good parts are that it gets a guy to work on himself in terms of appearance, education, hobbies, bad to focus on getting laid and seeing women in terms of standardized values rather than having the balls to choose a woman according to your own values. Ugly is how some of the material glorifies borderline antisocial behaviour
A lot of the material is in essence neutral but some people just don’t feel it when it comes to social interaction. They can read manuals but will apply it in an awkward way because of their lack of empathy and social insight. Men with personality disorders or socialy stunted men also have sexual desires, so they too tend to seek out this sort of material. Unless they oversome their issues, they tend to stay unsuccesful with women and stick in that community as opposed to the average guy who improves himself a bit, sows his wild oats for a year and then falls in love. The more frustrated guys are also more likely to seek out material about how all women are bad, so they can feel less frustrated about not being succesful with women.
I’m a celibate woman who uses pheromones, including sexual pheromones and I don’t feel I’m wasting my money. I very much enjoy being sexy, and it has nothing to do with “scoring sex with lots of guys”. It is fun to be sexy and to flirt with people for its own sake, you have a good time and put a smile on the face of others, it makes the world a happier place. I also flirt with women although I’m straight, women like to feel good and have their ego’s stroked too. I flirt with kids, teenagers and senior citizens, every man likes to feel like a man, and every woman likes to feel like a woman. I know I would never find Tho One among people of inappropiate age nor am I perverted enough to seek them out sexually. Not all flirting is aimed at a goal beyond smiling with the world.
Pheromones are a modern, but normal, part of flirtation, sexyness and allure. It is natural to want to make a good impression and enchant others. Like an attractive hairlstyle, cute heels, a pretty dress, a dainty purse and glamourous make-up, they are just the icing, not the cake itself. Yet, if I baked a good, tasty cake, why would I hide how delicious and wholesome it was by icing it in a sloppy way?
Why should a woman refrain from advertising herself favorably and cheat herself out of popularity with men if she is not looking for flings? Going on dates is fun, you learn a lot about men and you have more men to choose from. No need to sleep around to benefit from popularity.a
If I would meet a guy that is the right man for me, his character would be the reason I chose him over the others, but I would still very much enjoy a lively sense of humour, a neat haircut, a buff pair of shoulders and a sexy cologne. I know men and women are different, but I do feel men too enjoy the icing the same as I do.
Welp… I think there are some good points in here.
I’ve found that I haven’t been reading the men’s forum much lately. There does seem to be a lot of B.S. over there lately, and it’s sort of turned me off of testing and reporting. Mostly because results I seem to be aiming for just seem to be lost in the cloud of everything else… I haven’t really given up on pheromones, but I rarely even use them these days…
I think there are a lot of women over here that are really testing these pheromones right and taking chances on new molecules. So that’s what I’ve been reading mostly.
It’s very refreshing just to read things from a different perspective, and I think there is a lot of insight to be gained.
I still do read some posts on the men’s journal, mostly those made by members who’s opinion and testing I’ve already grown to respect.
And I have to agree with marty! There’s a core group that I really respect and follow and even a few of the newer members, and this forum has been like a second home to me in the past, but there’s been a number of new members who have joined the forum and the atmosphere just isn’t the same anymore.
I believe a vast majority of this forum has the wrong idea of what Pickup Really is…
It is in essence a screening process.
It teaches men how to screen the vast majority of women out before they even approach. Therefore increasing their chances of suscess.
Some of the more rogue guys that are sleezes yes they are off the deep end, Ross jefferies, and Tyler D. to only name two.
I do not believe in fake higher value stories, use your own, make it about you.
However the methodological approach to how men and women interact is quite real and true.
I’m sorry if I am not willing to be the free drink low self esteem guy for all the pretty ladies.
I will never do that again, and it is rare that you will meet your future spouse at “the club”.
All of those stupid tricks lose merit where it matters… During the day.
Don’t bash the few who use it to screen.
But I can see ladies bashing the guys who use material and fool a girl into bed…
Then again… isn’t it on you for taking a guy home on the first night?
Standards people, if you have them, then Pickup skill sets will help a guy get to know a girl and present themselves on their best foot.
But please please, do not bash a method of approach just because you “do not want to use it”
We all use it in our daily lives, some are just better than others.
I believe a lot of the flax comes from inexperienced people posting rhetorical rhetoric to the contrary of the positive sides of the methods. -added 11:14AM
What is Spotting IOI’s… PUA!!! DING DING DING DING!!.
your right.
the gals sleeping with you on the first date arent the ones complaining about liars and low-lives.
they have no intention of persuing you, you killed an evening.
those are the ones you think you conquored
that pretended to believe the BS
because they were in the mood as well.
even though sleeping with you on the first date
pretty much implies that you didnt have to work for it,
and that they were prolly going to do it anyways,
it gives you guys this false sense
that the BS worked lol.
she prolly would have slept with you if you just said
“grunt?”
I have to disagree unless you are going to put a percentage to that so it can be tested LOL
I love ya Lor, Much respect you know that.
But Men are not ignorant, and women are not helpless.
Do not fault men for taking advantage of you, Fault yourself.
Men, do not fault ladies for taking advantage of you, Fault yourself.
That is really all that needs to be said on the subject.
absolutely, everyone is entitled to an opinion.
mine are based on several years of 6-days-a-week watching the “game” get played… as my JOB 
.
every comes to opinions by experience,
its for this reason that i offer my opinion so readily
but i wont say its the only way to see it.
for instance,
i dont have the point of view of being buzzed and trying to get laid.
only of watching it happen to others.
Both men and women need to stop doing things for others that they resent later on. Resentment is one of the ugliest emotions and a sure way to turn off and repell others. Some girls give sex they don’t want to give to snare a guy, some guys buy presents they don’t want to buy to snare a girl. Not everyone is just generous or easy. Sometimes people do not know how to bond with someone emotionally so they use sex or money instead. Truth is, it is not the generosity or the easiness that causes the opposite sex to abandon you, it is the lack of emotional connection, the desperation and above all the resentment destroys romantic success.
If you take a guy home and have sex with him, be satisfied with the current level of commitment after sex. If you still want to have sex, not expecting it to work magic, then enjoy the ride, if not, you are likely in for a hangover. If you take a girl out and pay her way, don’t expect more than a nice evening and a sincere thank you. If you arent interested enough in a girl to date her for the sake of spending time with her, why date her at all?
Keeping the score of who gives what makes things overly business like. Why worry about who gets the biggest slice of the cake when you can multiply cakes by exercising your empathy muscles. Give when you enjoy the act of giving because you like to see the other person enjoy it and you enjoy sharing, not just to get something back. When I make a nice dinner for my friends, I enjoy sharing a tasty recipe that I take pride in creating, I enjoy seeing my friends be happy with the delicious food, I enjoy receiving compliments. Getting treated by them in return is a bonus.
Yeh, I think a lot of women who are inclined to have one night stands with this or that guy, probably care about making it something more, just about as much as the guy. The difference is, I think for these type of women…it’s not about getting off, being horny, or getting fucked good. It’s about validation. You got off, she got validated in her brain. The better looking the guy…the more validation. 15 minutes, 1 faked orgasm and a used trojan later–you both got exactly what you wanted. She probably cares about pursuing a relationship, just about as much as you, because next weekend she will be getting her validation from another guy. It’s a match made in heaven!
You live in a sad world BB… EDIT- I hate to say it, but some girls are screwed in the head and it is validation. She’s right for those.
Butterfly - That is the same game with different rules, not rules I play by.
Lor - I agree in a sense.
No I live in a HAPPY world and am not impressed by most things a lot of women are. Good sex is something I take VERY seriously. I am merely pointing out what you are often seeing in the clubs and what often motivates drunk party girls to screw a PUA. What I am describing with the validated parties girls is NOT my world…it’s the world of a lot of men with the pick up mentality.