Nobody knows for sure except for the creators. All you’ll get are guesstimates and wild speculation. Of course you could take a sample to a lab for spectroscopic analysis…
There is a mistake in your numbers about IG. Probably it was miscommunicated. IG contains a total of 15 mcg/spray of pheromones out of which 12.5 mcg is -rone and rest 2.5 mcg contains of modifiers which are speculated to be TAC/TAK.
Isn’t that what they used to make the Power Puff Girls? A little sugar & spice, and everything nice, and an accidental dash of chemical X! ![]()
Maybe MHarris is professor Utonium! ![]()
All I wanna know is.. how ARTIFICIAL is Artificial Copulins. If not much, then… elaborate. If so… also elaborate… ![]()
I believe they’re the same as other pheromones and most fragrances–derived from petroleum distillates. I suppose you could harvest “human musk” but it would be extremely expensive not to mention issues of hygiene and public safety. You might wanta to a search in the women’s forum as EW is a much discussed topic.
petroleum distillates…?
It makes sense to an extent. It’d take some cash/time to find out what’s in a mix. But someone who could do chromatography, had a GC mass spec, etc. should be able to take apart a chemical mix.
It’s a speed bump, not a wall.
You have a lot of rouge companies out there especially lately. Perfume companies, vitamin companies etc etc have all jumped on the ban wagon to try to make a buck. Then you have ebay sellers who buy some chemicals from china mix them up in the garage and sell them to unsuspecting people. None of these people have a clue when it comes to pheromones. You really have to know who your buying from.
Legit companies will have the equipment to test on and the knowledge and experience with pheromones. So yes its just a speed bump to them but these companies who are serious about there mones generally have there own formulas and conduct there business ethically. They get along with all the other pheromone companies and work together.
You dont see the big boys or serious pheromone companies attacking or stealing from other companies. AD until recently was at the top of the industry. Lack of availability when it comes to molecules and price increases are doing some damage. The economy took its toll here. Fly by nighters and unethical companies try to get there formulas and have even attacked this forum and site and certain members of it. I know this for a fact because I have had my problems with them as well. AD is not going to make that easy for them to do.
So even though its a speed bump its still slows down those rouge companies and bitter former members who have nothing better to do but attack, lie and make up falsehood from getting there hands on formulas . They just dont have the money, support, equipment or knowledge to do it.
Tisha
Of course, Tisha.
That’s a fine explanation of the business view and I respect it.
But from the consumer’s point of view, I’m one of those guys who reads ingredient labels. I’ve had some seriously bad reactions to “Ammo” and so have those around me. I’d like to nail down what caused those bad reactions (Straight androstenone overdose? Porcine derived androstenone? Or something else?) so I can avoid it. Lots of mones that are good in one situation are bad in another, so a detailed understanding of contents is very beneficial to me. This is especially true given the changing nature of AD’s mixes. I understand that AD isn’t making it easy for its competitors. That’s a good business strategy. But they’re not making it easy for me, either. But then, I’m also one of those rare eggs who installed linux on his extra computers. I know I’m not the mainstream and I understand if most businesses don’t cater to me.
In any case, out of 5 rouge companies 1 or 2 may be honest competitors. Good for me. Bad for AD.
For those of us interested in history, Arther Andersen used to be a paragon of virtue in the accounting world. Companies change over time, and sunlight is the best disinfectant. Look at a company like Jarrow in the supplement industry. They’re reputable and profitable in part because people know whats in their stuff and can get copies of the tests for purity as needed. Not just a brand name. Who would trust them if they just pointed to their brand name and ‘rogue upstart vitamin companies.’ (There are plenty of rogue upstart supplement companies too, after all.)
And conversely, there are lots of “reputable” folks in the supplement industry that use sub-standard ingredients like cyanocobalamin as B12 in place of superior and more expensive ingredients like cobalamin or methylcobalamin. A brand name is ideal only for those not willing to build up a deeper understanding of the product. Unfortunately, that’s ~90% of the population.
http://oi42.tinypic.com/5p0xlv.jpg
I hope this is enough grains of salt for everybody.
Reminds me of wintertime driving back in Chicago.
I know they are not making it easy for the consumer. We tend to forget its not a consumer based company. Its a research based company. Sure the consumer products fund the research but its not like your run of the mill pheromone market place.
I read labels on everything as well and I do my research. When I wanted to know what I was using here I talked to the people who made it. They dont give you all the details but they will help you as much as they can.
Its just not going to be on the label. Just like with cologne. They dont publish there exact formula. Its up to you whether you use it or not.
Tish
I can see this is an old thread but I want to know if Instant Shine has DHEA sulphate?
I can’t link you just now but you could try the DHEA//TAA thread from the 9th of this month that discusses just this in more detail. It won’t be too far off the top of the boards.
So this thread had me thinking since it went up… what all pheromones do we know have desirable effects on humans…
alpha androstenol
beta androstenol
androsterone
alpha androstenone
adrosterone
areandrostenone
androstadienone
anyone have any others to add to the list, actual names of compounds?
(3beta,5alpha)-Androstan-3-ol . Interesting science with this one. I haven’t tested it. One really has to look at the exact structure (every atom and bond) to make sure whatever you’re reading is the molecule you think it is. This one has many synonyms. Sometimes mentioned in literature as a suspected pheromone. Wouldn’t surprise me if SmartMones had it. I’d probably want it, were I them. Or many of us could already have it.
*Human semen was examined for the presence of 16-androstenols, 16-androstenones and androgens. Extracts were analysed by gas chromatography-mass spectrometry after derivatization of steroids under study. In a qualitative study, 5 alpha-androst-16-en-3 alpha- and 3 beta-ols, 5,16-androstadien-3 beta-ol and 5 alpha-androstan-3 beta-ol [synonym] were detected in a semen pool A. *
http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/096007609290243C
5a-Androstan-3b-ol-17-one is also epiandrosterone (Beta Androsterone). The two are structurally similar. Also in that abstract is 5,16-Androstadien-3β-ol (common name Androstadienol – not Beta dienol). The fluids in question also contained Alpha and Beta androstenols.
pregnenolone
pregnanolone (many variants)
Dehydroepiandrosterone (DHEA) and its variants DHEAS and DHEAS sodium, or potassium
androsterone Epi, Epi-S, and S
androstanone (3-keto and 17-keto)
Some of these have only putative effects in humans. Others are analogs of established compounds. Good molecular chemists can keep coming up with new refinements, new ideas for what each molecule should look like.
Hard to come up with a comprehensive list surely, as many new compounds are proprietary.
I presume you mean 5α-Androstan-3-one, AKA 3-keto-5-alpha-androstane. You’ll probably turn up some abstracts on those. One compared swine lordosis vs. -eNone. Quacks like a duck, pheromonally.
Search Google with those exact strings in quotes. But then you also have 17-beta-Hydroxy-5-alpha-androst-2-ene, same formula C19 H30 O as, but a different structure to, androstanone.
You presume correctly ![]()
I went ahead and gave the layman’s term, but sure, if you want to get technical ![]()
I’m not a chemist, personally, but I’ve done my best to become phero literate, so to speak. Without taking organic chemistry I don’t think I’ll get much closer to understanding the jargon you speak ![]()
Your insight is appreciated all the same.
Good man, Red. If the purpose of this board is to advance the science of mones, perhaps more threads like this will do so. I previously used a 3D visualization of Alpha Nol as my avatar. Some years ago, Jasmin referenced the Van Der Waals similarity between P75 and 79, disclaiming a similarity to androstanone. An accurate way to visualize a molecule in 3D (and identify it correctly) is with a free software viewer called JMOL. One loads the SMILES format into the viewer. Thus, my avatar was born. Alpha nol is **C[C@]12CC[C@H]3C@HCC[C@@H]4[C@@]3(CCC@HO)C .
**The Van Der Waals solvent surface tries to predict solvent-molecule interaction.
And now you know…the rest of the story.