Removing public and other body hair has been common for centuries in China and other Eastern and Middle Eastern culturies. Well-to-do Chinese brides were well waxed for their wedding night (not that they naturally have much hair!). The West is merely a bit late to catch on. Realize it hasn’t been very long since regular bathing caught on the the USA…
Funny, my clothing seems to be getting increasingly tight…
All right, back home! Procrastinating on my homework by catching up!
I never expected such a response! I’ve read every single post carefully, and am with Vkat. I began to tear up, and it dawned on me how serious this issue is to me. And to a lot of women. They were amazing comments.
Chirimoya, Lor, Vkat, Ilsa, Dolly, Nunya, Carrie, EVERYONE – you are all amazing people, and gorgeous.
It truly is a mindset that has to change with me, and no one can do that except myself. And most of the time, it’s all right. But MOST of the time is the key. For as high as I’ve been on compliments and hits and the effects of pheromones, and stolen glances and moments, eventually they will fade away, and I am left with myself and the love I have for me. Which should be a lot bigger.
But you guys have really opened my eyes to that. And I never realized how much those comments still effect me, brutally. And what Ilsa wrote opened a wound a little deeper, only to help it begin to heal properly.
As for photography:
Ilsa – you are incredible. If you are serious about your generous offer, I have no idea if I could get to you, but I am so appreciative and honored anyway.
And MarkL mentioned learning how to pose, smile, and all of that. I’ve picked up tips about that, but it really is hit and miss. Especially in social situations. You really don’t understand – guys will be like, “Take a picture with me!” And I’ll warn them that I don’t photograph well. They don’t believe me, we take it, they look at the picture and they actually look really confused when they look back at me. It’s pretty amusing. And not at the same time. 
But here is the story:
There was a boy who was interested in my roommate. He was looking at pictures online, and there was one photo I was in. He made a comment basically saying I was ugly. I was MORTIFIED. And then really pissed off. My roommate was completely turned off by him, thought he was a shallow bugger (good girl, and due to other situations), but he was coming over the next day. I decided not to get revenge, but to prove a point. So I turned up the charm. It isn’t flirting, but it’s certainly brightening up a bit, and I was actually surprised I still knew how.
When he saw me, he did a COMPLETE 180. We all went out to dinner (including a couple of other friends), and by the end of the night we parted amicably. He had the audacity later on to rate me to my roommate, and even rate me higher than her. A real keeper, that one.
So this being one of many stories, you can see my aversion to photographs. I’m better in motion.
But down to the very core of all these topics of looks and attraction, confidence is so key. I have it, it just needs to be solid, and based on myself, not on others’s reactions to me.
As for the other things I wanted to talk about, I’ll put them off for another time. There is deeper stuff going on.
Love to all!
I’ve been reading this thread, but I’ve abstained from saying anything because of how close to home it hits. There definitely is deeper stuff going on, Saraunne - so deep, in fact, that it resonates within all of us in a different way. I teared up too.
I understand your reaction to that “shallow bugger” essentially calling you ugly (which you most definitely aren’t, hun - in my opinion, that comes from inside, as was said before ^_^). My previous boyfriend made a point of criticizing some part of me every day, telling me how he liked this feature better on this girl, how I needed to change it. I’m STILL recovering from that, how horrible I felt about myself. By the time I had the courage to break up with him, I was convinced everything he said was true. Every time someone told me I was pretty I would feel hurt, attacked, like they were lying to me, poking fun at me. I wish I could have turned that pain into something positive, like you did.
But you’re right. Confidence IS key, it’s all in how you carry yourself, I find. How much you love yourself, it’ll show, and it’ll inspire the same feelings in everyone else. Luckily, thanks to Ail and a lot of the other ladies here, I’m improving this aspect of myself. I hope everyone can learn to respect and love themselves as they deserve… which is a lot, and something that no one else can replicate or replace.
Good luck to all of you,
and lots of love from Alseides.
<3.
You all are beautiful women.
Choosing the right pond is tricky…
Is it better to be a big frog in a small pond or a small frog in a big pond? Here, economist Robert H. Frank argues that concerns about status permeate and profoundly alter a broad range of human behavior. He shows how status considerations affect the salaries people earn, the way they spend them, and even many of the laws, regulations, and cultural norms they adopt. Provocative and insightful, this book is sure to spark widespread and lively debate in classrooms and boardrooms alike.
Amazon.com: Choosing the Right Pond: Human Behavior and the Quest for Status: Books: Robert H. Frank
unfortunately it’s hard to go back once you have experienced the big pond…
thanks for the link to that book, PheroQuirk. Looks like reading right up my alley.
But back to the thread…yah, I’ve teared up too. I’m sitting with a lump in my throat. Vkat:
…these are such powerful words. Why is there so much pain and why has it gone so wrong? Why do we all seek to be seen as beautiful by another, and why are we in such dire need of this now? It seems from anecdotal evidence to be a deep seated need or desire to be found attractive and WANTED by another. Perhaps the issue is one of desire, of need, and because we have so many options now, humans don’t “need” each other as they once did, or the need is filled more easily with many of the wash-and-go, lite options available to us now.
If we were more cognizant of our inter-dependence, if we admitted our need for one another a bit more, would we find each other more beautiful? Or does need, companionship, even love get in the way of our ever upgraded yet downsized lifestyle (ironic, eh? We want more and more but tell ourselves we “need” less and less of that messy human stuff like love).
I find this plays out right in my closest relationships, and while I don’t have the answers, I know that it is painful and I even question myself if thinking about such things isn’t some leftover, no-longer-effective-remnant of a more romantic (and connected) past.
Chirimoya – I’ve been thinking about what you wrote and the questions you so eloquently posed.
And I’m certainly not going to try to answer them (which I’m sure wasn’t the point), but there are two things I kept thinking about afterward.
The media: I watch older movies and am surprised at how normal looking almost everybody is. Especially in the 80s. The extras look like regular people. Watch movies made today. Even the people walking down the street are model gorgeous.
I’ve seen the Dove Campaign for Beauty – and I think it’s brilliant. But what is sad is to actually visit the website and look at the polls. So many people don’t get it. And these stunning women have a surprising percentage of being considered not beautiful.
We are flooded, drowning in what we are told is beautiful or ugly, and without a support base to keep us grounded (my God, thank you guys for being here. Sometimes there are things my friends can’t understand, and I can’t talk to my mom about), it is so hard not to give in. I know I did.
And there is SUCH an importance placed on romantic love. And this is something I’ve been dealing with, too. For years, I’ve been fascinated with romance. Read all the books, seen all the movies, hated anything with a sad ending. So many people feel the pressure to date and get married and live happily ever after.
And now feeling freedom after a long time, I find myself disinterested in romantic love for myself – and yet I’m writing a romance novel as we speak. And pretty far into it (though not your bodice ripper, by any means 
).
But then again, what is romance? What is love? Romantic love? Why is it so desirable? I think it’s so much more than a sophisticated way of procreation and protection of progeny. There is an energy there, and especially in healthy relationships, the comfort, the stability and companionship.
I had a gay friend I talked candidly with about homosexuality, and he said he was getting fat. 
He is by far the most gorgeous man I have ever seen in person, on paper, or on film. Ever. He is Adonis. But he said, “You don’t understand as a woman. Men are so visually oriented. If you’re not in a commited relationship by 30, you’re done. You need to be young, handsome, and ripped.”
Now this is one man’s personal experience and opinion, but it floored me.
Everyone wants to be loved, and appreciated. And I think the most instantaneous way is by appreciating beauty. We are inspired by beauty. Nature, fine art, music, architecture, poetry, literature. Anything that is beautiful keeps us alive and vital. Being appreciated for our own beauty, however that is defined, might be the most powerful, and the most valuable.
–
And I hacked this thing to pieces because I really couldn’t express what I wanted to say. Hopefully this is better.
you know as far as being photogenic - people who take great pictures no matter what, tend to look strange and angular in real life. They translate well in 2 dimensions. But in 3 dimensions, not so much. I wouldn’t take it too hard that you don’t photograph well - you spend more time being a real-life 3-dimensional human being - and that’s where the acton is anyways.
with me photos are hit or miss. when they hit they really hit, when they miss, man do they miss. But whatever. I am more than my image.
His experience in the gay subculture doesn’t wholly translate to the world at large. Yes, men are more visually oriented than women but not completely shallow! The “need to be young, handsome, and ripped” really depends on the individuals involved. As a young upstart I might have sorta agreed with his assessment, but even then I knew it wasn’t true most of the time. The older I get, the easier it seems to attract the opposite sex–not anyone, but beautiful women with education and refinement. Sure I workout almost daily, dress well and have a good job, but my days of being “young, handsome, and ripped” are long past. Well, I was never ripped but hopefully I nailed two outta three. Anywho, as most posters have written in this thread, looks are only a single component of a complicated whole.
Also, I think there is much to be gained from struggle, whether it be with inner demons, appearance or external factors beyond your control. Just as long as you’re not a quitter, you grow and strengthen by leaps and bounds.
[quote=“vkat”]
…
alright, so these women entered a contest where they could have everything done to encourage beauty…
not a good picture, but average in the beginning, models when they were done.
anyone with 50-100g could be t.v. ready
im ok with not being on t.v.
Ok, I am going to say something here.. and maybe I am onto something, and maybe not, but I think it’s part of the human condition to worry about one’s looks. Just like we are programmed for certain games that we play with ourselves to keep us occupied FOR THE REST of our silly short lives. Like making money, like making ourselves look better, because EVERYONE except for maybe the 0.000002% of the unaffected, believes that they are ugly. What else? We worry about dimples on our asses. What a waste of our lives, if you think about it. Shouldn’t we be focused on achieving enlightenment? Or saving the world? Don’t answer that.
That was a regular retorical conversation I have with myself daily. And still fall prey to the life-wasting silly games, just like the rest of the world. Which makes myself be pissed at myself.
Oh and the money-makers have a field day with our human condition of insecurities. Like, oh, you’re depressed (who is truly happy here, the Dalai Lama?)? Take a pill (and don’t get me started on that one, I will EXPLODE). You think you are ugly? Why not try this cover-up? Need money? Well, let me tell you how I made my first million…
Need I say more?
as a bartender i heard day-in and day-out guys talking about the women they were with.
i was just discussing this topic with a friend of mine this morning.
he went off on how horrible and disgusting guys talk about the women they were just seducing the week before.
the fact that women know this make us more inclined to be guarded for one, and more inclined to worry about those very things they talk about.
the point im making here is that if you are liking the guys you meet during a particular hobby, your odds are increased that you will have that one thing in common that connects you.
having a drink in common invites what people do when they drink-
talk.
a hobby in common hasnt much to do with looks.
stay away from the very things that try your confidence, and keep company with the things that help you shine.
if it means turning off the tv, then have some discipline.
if it means turning away from the things you ritually compare yourself to, then freakin say enough.
if right at this very moment you are saying -
“yeah sounds easy but its not. i am compelled to check to make sure i stack-up”
then you just proved my point that its NOT the outside world making you insecure… its only the thoughts about yourself compelling you conform.
Yea, the outside world is putting oil on the fire.. For sure. And capitalizing, as the case may be..
yeah but we’ll show them…mua hahahaha…more pheromones…less makeup…more pheromones…less Gucci…more pheromones…less starvation diets…more pheromones…less surgery…more pheromones…MORE FANTASTIC MIND BLOWING SEX…
whoa.
i have NO idea where that came from.
giggles at Lor
I do…you were sniffing your TAL and Essence of Woman… HAHAHAHAHAAAAAAAA
such hot glamour girls!!
jasmin,saraunne,ail, lor,dolly,chirimoya,carrie,nunya laurieny???
lol i can’t hardly tell from the pic, but that last chick in the front could be me. possibly. you’re funny - where are you in this tho? I guess it doesn’t matter cuz you’re a russ meyers girl! w00t!!
bawm chick-a bawm bawm…
how did i miss the last 2 posts here???
hahahahahahahahahahahaha
we are equiped with background music!!!