You should listen to her. Might make you a man. Youv a long way befor you are one
Another neg for this thread. LOL, I’m not a man!
For you repper, evidence to the contrary: I can tell you SteveO is indeed a man, and a gentleman for that matter. He always opens doors for me and pulls out my chair. 
steveo
if for whatever reason i am attacked verbally, i hope no one comes to my rescue.especially you.
not because i dont think you are a wonderful guy for standing up for both what you believe in and for someone you think cant do it themselves, but because BY DOING SO YOU SHOW THAT YOU HAVE LITTLE FAITH THEY CAN HANDLE THEIR OWN SHEET.
i know why you did what you did, and if i thought you a terrible person i would go elswhere to post, but you jumped in as if curiouspua was this helpless little boy that could not handle his own stuff.
if that is not the reason, then why is anyone here jumping to anyones defense?
people draw to themselves what they have to so that they can get-over it…to know they are better then that.
i for one am no example of how to be because i see percieved injustice and want to respond.
i aspire to not be a responder.
alas,it happens :o
also i commend the only person who gave thought to the fact that Ail might have reasons and be justified for her view.
it takes a weird and often lonely person to back up and think “hmmm why does this person feel this way? she doesnt know me, so this is obviously not about me personally, but about the behaviour or thing that i stand for.”
shes allowed to have opinions about the behaviour and thing that you stand for. thats not having an opinion about your soul and very spirit that you are.
Look.
A lot of women in this thread admitted to being in abusive relationships at one time. I mayself was abused for many years as a child.
Therefore, it is hard for such woman to have a man say, “We know what women want and they don’t.”
It (to me) brings up feelings of, “No! I know what I want, and what I don’t want, and I deserve to be treated with that kind of respect!” In other words, “I know I don’t want some jerk who doesn’t care about how I feel/might hurt me.”
Now, when it comes to normal, healthy relationships, I actually agree: a lot of women don’t know exactly what they want. Do I want someone who is intellectually stimulating or someone who can always support me financially? It’s a hard call. And one that changes, especially with younger women (like me).
But for someone like Ali, or Dolly, or even Lor, they have been around the block. They have been told by abusive men that they couldn’t choose for themselves what they wanted. And so to have ANY man, even in the kindest of respects, say that all women are ignorant of that, can easily cause a very defensive response.
I think it is a more correct (not to mention safer) assumption that we, as women, may not know EXACTLY EVERY DETAIL of what we want in a man, but we DO know that we want respect, love, and honesty.
All of which (might I add) as this forum originally stated: have nothing to do with looks.
Thanks for reading.
xoxo
jp
I know SteveO clearly knows I can “handle” this. But when Ail started this illogical rant, who wouldn’t comment?
I think it’s also because I’m new to this board, so it was like the women vs. the stupid new guy. So by “standing up” for me, he implied you that it wasn’t just me against all the others on here.
That was just one thing he did, consciously or unconsciously, don’t know…
But if you look at my posts on this thread, you can see that I never said anything personal. I never attacked, I just wanted to explain and get a point out to the boys. For that matter, I never looked at Ail’s personal situation and held back, simply because I felt the need to explain to the guys on here the what’s and why’s.
It would also be kindof silly for me to confront Ail like the guys on here because I’ve only read her posts about this particular topic. So I only know how she feels about this subject, and I’ve gotten some responses from women that are relatable to her posts…
Very well said there JP. In fact not many men know exactly what they want. That’s the beauty of relationships; its finding out togethor what you want.
Getting to the point of abusive relationships. I despise people who are abusive towards anyone, hence my response to an abusive Ail.
Being abused is no excuse to be abusive!
And to the Neg repper that said "
http://www.pheromonetalk.com/../images/reputation/reputation_neg.gif
You should not make such generalizations"
Well, if you would look at my former posts, I clearly stated that I made a lot of them, and all I said did in no way apply to all women, or men for that matter.
I wouldn’t want to start each post with “I make a lot of generalizations”… If you’re intelligent enough, you would assume that what people say is not always “generalizations”.
The “2+4” qoute may have seemed that way, but hey, who can give me evidence to the contrary? That women do not abide biological laws?
Oh, I completely agree.
All I’m saying toward that is that maybe we can all step back a little a try to realize where she is coming from and why she is being defensive. It’s a natural instinct to try and protect one’s self when they feel they are being attacked.
And being told by a man that a woman can’t choose for herself is, to someone like me who was abused, an attack, and we will try to stand up for ourselves like we couldn’t then.
Thanks for the support steveo.
xoxo
jp
Well Lor read my post response to JP above.
Abusive people need to be put in their place and if you feel it necessary to stand back and allow it to happen then people will continue to be abused. That I have no tolerance nor respect for. I will not sit idly by and allow another person to be abused just because someone else believes that by standing up for them their position is diminished.
Anyone who stands aside and does nothing is just as guilty if they were the abuser themselves.
As men we band together as we have throughout history to support what we believe in. “Together we stand, but divided we fall”
Standing together is not to say that the defense cannot be accomplished by a single person or that such person is unable to defend themselves. It is nature that tells us to join forces to support what we believe in as a collective.
Let me ask you…Why would we leave our friend to stand by himself when we could easily stand beside him.
If she is justified in her statement then why won’t she show us such justifications. We cannot read minds.
Heh, I feel like Spock here kind of sitting back observing two alien life forms battling back and forth.
Just as a point of clarification for me, do you consider physical abuse the same as flames being exchanged on an internet message board?
jp I understand what you are saying, but i don’t think it’s very self-empowering to use what happened in the past as an excuse to act any old way in the present.
My childhood was pretty abusive too, i’ve been hit by men, I’ve been raped by men, but I’ll be damned if I let peoples actions in the past control my behavior, attitude and perception of the world here and now. If I do they still have power over me.
JP, you are truely an inseration to many.
Self-empowering? No, I don’t think so either.
But it happens. And is sometimes hard to control. If you’ve gotten past it, I as very happy for you and congratulate you on your success. I still struggle sometimes myself, but I haven’t attacked anyone here (at least I hope no one thought I was attacking them).
I’m just hoping for a little more understanding.
That really is awesome of you though. I’m kinda in awe about it actually—maybe you could pm me and let me know how you got yourself through it? I’d appreciate the insight from someone who’s already been there.
Thanks.
xoxo
jp
pm on the way - but I’ll jsut say - I’m never all the way through, but I strive every day to evolve a little bit more.
Wow, JP, you have such grace in your posts, it’s profound.
I can easily tell you that you’re handling yourself well compared to what you’ve been through.
It’s so sad, it’s just horrifying that so many women go through abuse, especially disgusting if it has been done in their childhood(often has).
I give them respect to still be able to carry themselves after such destruction.
This is EXACTLY what I was trying to tell you, but I think it was much better to hear it echoed by JP.
fighting begets more fighting. stand beside your brother. join a gang,get a tattoo. its all good.
from my point of view, it isnt the people getting bashed, its what they stand for, what they align with and agree with.
if we dont know you, how can it be personal?
if you take it personal, you are the one that needs help-
to see it from another perspective, not because you are damaged.
Those who are familiar with the seduction community, be prepared to laugh…
She just gave an awesome deffinition of unreactiveness, haha…
“It’s not you, it’s your approach… being blown of just means: CHANGE YOUR APPROACH”. 
Thalion,
I’m sure you would agree mental abuse and verbal abuse can be just as serious as physical abuse. Wouldn’t you?
After all, most physically abused persons will also receive mental/verbal abuse to lower their self-worth as a person thus keep them right where they are. I see no difference in abusive types. Abuse is abuse.
Certainly there is more urgency in dealing with physical abuse, but that is not to say that you stand back and do nothing about mental/verbal abuse.
JP, I understand about what you are saying about understanding, but where does that understanding begin and end and who decides when its OK to be understanding on one side and not the other?
I guess it’s OK for me to be abusive in my tone to Ail, because as a child I suffered from an abusive mother. It’s OK for me to curse her because as a young man I was abusive to myself.
So I was abused so all this is mute because I was. I am officially allowed to curse out anyone I want because I was abused.
Hey Toil, go fuck yourself you bastard cause I didn’t get my two-day express mail package from you. Damn fucker you! 
J/K
That’s OK though Toil, you can’t get annoyed because I was abused and you need to have understanding.
Sorry JP, not a personal attack on you either, and I appreciate that thing you sent me. I just needed to point out how abused persons cannot be afforded a free pass based on past encounters alone. Society would be filled with some bad people.