Data4's Journal

Field Reports & Anecdotal Experience Men's Journals
101

Daedelus, you sound a lot like me overall, from the mental blank I get when it comes to small talk, to not exactly being a social butterfly. You’ll notice throughout my time here that I haven’t yet gone to any clubs of the non-strip variety, nor have I attended many parties. It’s mainly because I’m the kind of guy who can feel alone in a crowded room. It’s the ultimate in approach anxiety.

I do okay in the strip clubs because the frame is already set. You WILL be approached by a stripper eventually, and you can let them lead the conversation by keeping your part in it yes and no answers. But put me in a regular nightclub, and I’ll be forever in the corner nursing a beer because running through my mind is every reason why I’ll fail, pheromones or not.

At work it’s a little different, since once again, there’s already a frame set and the work at hand is something I’m pretty good at, so there’s the conversation fodder right there.

One thing I’m having difficulty with is getting a social circle built up. There aren’t a lot of people my age that I associate with. Every once in awhile, I’ll get together with 4 or 5 guys from work and go have a beer, but their average age is about 26 or 27, and I’m 35. Doesn’t seem like too much of a gap, but I can kind of tell I’m just hanging in on the fringe sometimes.

Anyway, all of this to say from one socially handicapped guy to another, go ahead and get that A314. Even start with just 1 drop split to your wrists. If for no other reason, use it for work. There’s a whole ladder of managers I have to deal with, and I’m convinced that the A314 has given me an added boost to my interactions with them. I find even the highest levels of management that I’ve dealt with have treated me almost like an equal, when the same managers kind of go into politician mode with other people-- you know, completely fake, and suffering through the lowly subordinate’s schpiel in order to look good. With me, I don’t get that. They’re more empathetic, attentive, and responsive, and it’s that sort of relatability that I’m going to try to leverage to move up in Boeing.

Keep in mind that I’m just a blue collar production tech. If you only knew the chasm that exists between the shop floor workers and management, you’d understand the significance of this. I’m not too falsely modest to not recognize that I do seem to have the ability to talk to these people on their terms and in their language, but I’m confident that A314 has really helped that along.

Just thought I’d share that. A314 is the best thing I have in my arsenal, hands down.

-D4

102

Yeah, I think we have alot in common. You even know what lazy-eye/amblyopia is :slight_smile:

I’ll take it under advice. Let’s just say I, umm, live on the wrong side of town for strip clubs. I can’t say I haven’t thought about doing it anyways, but I’d be nervous as hell and never live it down with people I know if they found out. My parents are really prudish sometimes. They aren’t heavily religious, just prudish. WASP + nouveau riches money.

I’ve actually thought about going to the local Unitarian Universalist church… or something. I need some more socialization. Something in my life. You know how it can be trying to find things to do in a suburb, when everybody around you is into making babies and earning money to pay for the big houses? I like some excitement or interest in my life from single people, and I’m at the age that isn’t really happening. But I’m not sure I’d know how to handle strippers.

That’s true but at the moment I am unemployed. My work history is lousy, to tell you the truth- I found it hard in the past to get close to people and alot of people get the wrong idea from me, they assume I’m not trustworthy or not a good worker becaues I didn’t socialize alot (and most employers don’t appreciate a liberal arts degree, even though I basicly have a minor in three different social science subjects).

I think it’s a reaction to how I was treated as a kid. I got alot of people that were uneasy around me, and I thought it was my fault, when it was actually their fault. So in the end I started having fewer and fewer friends. The friends I had, we were very close. Unfortunately, being a military dependent always ended those friendships and eventually I just gave up on having close friends and became a loner. I spent alot of my mid 20’s just being bitter- my brother was a really bad influence on me and my growth in the last couple of years has been a bit jarring because I’m having to back away from his attitudes. BTW he is my younger brother.

Also, my parents doted on me alot, and at the same time, I was constantly reminded of the fact I was “disabled”- by doctors, etc. As a kid I wanted to make my dad proud and join the military, and I had a military optometrist tell me at 11 that would never happen. I felt devestated and didn’t know how to recover. I was in special ed classes in school sometimes, and that didn’t always help either, especially because there was no smooth transition to college life. I have a “disability” granted, but I have an invisible one that is very hard to get any support for. People don’t know how to support it, and frankly at this point I don’t blame them. I just wish things went smoother for me growing up. I mean I had crazy stuff like a school trying to get me to use a cane, and yet nobody suggested I get a better optometrist (those prismatic glasses really, really helped out alot). I have alot of reasons to be bitter but I’m trying to let go of that because it was resulting in my self-destruction. Really slow self-destruction, like glaciers moving.

I have money saved up from investments so I’m fine with money. Right now I’m trying to improve myself. The economy in Florida is sucking hard, too. It’s not a great time to look for a job. I’m sure you know that, though. I check in with places every once in a while, though. It’s really depressing but I try not to let it get to me and not to measure myself by my employment, or lack of it.

I’ve tried alot of different therapies in the past and it’s a real hodge-podge, especially going to a county therapist, you get a different one every couple of weeks and only one guy really helped me improve at all (Rational Emotive Therapy- this was the first therapy I felt a bit uncomfortabel doing, but it helped, the others were wonks). So in the end I figure this is something I have to largely do I my own. I’ve also tried medications in the past without alot of improvement, though SSRI’s seemed to the most for me. BTW I was completely desexualized on some of them, no interest in women at all.

I was thinking a drop of A314 would be a good for a job situation, or the spray MX’s. It would really help me in an interview, that’s why I bought some MX 172… in case I get an interview. Probably 2 sprays and Instant Shine would help alot now. The problem is, with my work history would I look overqualified for low-end work? I mean if I actually talk to people halfway decent, I seem more talented than I am, but my work history is only low-end stuff.

I’ve lost job interviews being “honest” before. This was the way I was raised, to be a “Boy Scout” about everything (hey, I even was a Boy Scout- Lifescout) (I was also raised to feel ashamed of the fact I love talking and am naturally good with language - my dad told me that old Abe Lincoln saying about a “fool speaking” biz). I haven’t started learning how’s and why’s of interviewing until a few months ago.

Anyways, I’m sorry to hijack your journal. Please visit mine and give some inputs. Thanks.

Oh yeah, and you are a loner? Oh man, I thought you were a real player? Just shows you how good of a judge of character I am. Seriously, you are a great guy. Many thanks.

103

Hehe, well, the strip club was just an example of how I seem to do okay there, but I’m too timid at more… er… conventional clubs. Don’t take it as too much of an endorsement. :wink:

I guess I’ve been lucky these last few years. My childhood wasn’t easy either. I was one of three being raised by my mother, and we were pretty much poor. My mom, God bless her, did the best she could under the circumstances, but a black cloud seemed to follow us everywhere. We hit the skids when I was around 12, after she’d let a childhood friend stay with us for awhile. Turns out, she wasn’t much of a friend, as she stole my mom’s paycheck (Mom always cashed her check and kept her cash on hand back then. A full bank envelope in her purse was mighty tempting, and greed suddenly became more important than a 20+ year friendship… that bitch.)

Anyway, without going into a full life story, I kinda slacked off in highschool, and dropped out in the second quarter of my senior year. Yeah, I know… pretty god damned dumb of me, looking back on it. I did get a GED and took some computer classes in Voc. school. Nothing I didn’t know already, since I’ve always been a computer nerd, but I wanted to bring some legitimacy into my life.

I eventually got a job working in a PC sales and service center, on basically a lick and a promise. I was paid peanuts, but was assured as business picked up, so would my salary. After a year and a half of making below minimum wage (I was making a flat $975 a month, working 55+ hours a week) I said “screw this!” and quit for a job at a bowling alley making almost twice that.

While all this was going on, I met a girl online in a chatroom I frequented. We got to know eachother, and soon she was destined to become my future ex-wife. I moved up here, got a job at a bowling alley in the same chain as the one I worked at, and that’s when serendipity hit me. One of the guys I worked with was only a part timer. His “real job” was at a composites manufacturer in the area that made carbon fiber composite material for aerospace manufacturing. One of Boeing’s primary suppliers, in fact. One of the league bowlers was also an employee-- the head of security at that company as a matter of fact. Through these contacts, I managed to get on at that company as a security guard. A year later, I applied for and received a job in the QA testing lab. About 1.5 years later, one of my coworkers who I’d become pretty good friends with got a job at Boeing doing similar work. He gave me a heads up when that area opened up more positions, so I applied. The interview was one of those structured dealies where the questions they ask had nothing to do with the specifics of the job. Stuff like “How do you cope with working with many different people, from many different professional disciplines?” or “Describe a situation where you were given a task on short notice, a close deadline, and vague instructions for what’s needed?” As the old saying goes, when I couldn’t dazzle them with brilliance, I baffled 'em with bullshit, and got the job.

Believe me, I count myself very lucky. Boeing is a wonderful place to work and the opportunities for me are now limited by my own drive and motivation. I don’t have anything standing out in my pedigree to make me any better than the next guy, but being in the right place at the right time has landed me where I am. NOW, I have to take control to determine where I’m going to be in 3,5, even 10 years from now.

I know the economy sucks balls at the moment, and there’s not really much that can be done except ride it out and watch. Good for you that you’ve got a nestegg to rely on. I’m not sure what industries there are in Florida that would be the most fruitful to get into. I know that between Disney and Universal, the entertainment industry has a good chunk. I know Boeing’s got some stuff going on with NASA, but you literally have to be a rocket scientist to get on there.

I wish I could offer some useable advice on that without sounding pat or trite. And don’t worry, any discussion in my journal is good discussion, as far as I’m concerned. :wink:. I’ll be sure to give your’s a look.

-D4

104

BTW, without getting too personal, what state do you live in? Oregon? I’m just guessing

105

Who knows, maybe it would be a good idea. Honestly I just would have no way know how to treat the ladies there.

I think I would be really timid at conventional clubs too. For one thing I don’t drink much, if at all. I have this thing of not tolerating alcohol very well. For many years I was on anticonvulsants for migraines and depression, and I couldn’t really drink anyways.

106

Oil & Alcohol mixed and sprayed, experiment update.

I went with as small amount of oil as I could see without the use of graduated containers, which was 1/5 total volume. Mixed with the dyed alcohol, I shook it vigorously for 30 seconds and this time sprayed into an old cap from a 30 ml bottle. Much easier to look at from the side due to it being thinner than the shot glass.

Good news, guys! The spray, which was about a quarter of the to-go bottle again had a roughly 4:1 ratio of oil and alcohol! Since I can’t really go lower in oil content and still be able to give reasonably accurate results, I’m now going for testing over time. My next test will be another 1/4 of the bottle 24 hours from the first one. The next will be 72 hours after the second one, and the remaining quarter will be sprayed 1 week after the previous spray.

-D4

107

I have the scented SOE with the musk fragrance, and I really love the smell, It’s got a very clear scent, very light and refreshing, It’s a good standalone “none-less” product for general everyday purposes, don’t have to worry about OD.

108

Completely pheromone unrelated but I’d like to say that you have my deep respect for how you managed to make good out of your rough start. My dad’s current gf went through hell and back during her childhood. She’s now 45 and just getting ready to finally get a degree in psychology. It took her a long time but she persevered, along with her two younger siblings, whom she has fully supported since they were 5 and 7 years old. Amazing. This isn’t even mentioning that this is during post-war Korea when women didn’t have much opportunities for work, let alone schooling, if it wasn’t somehow supported by family. Back then (still is to an extent), it was go to the best university you can to net yourself a nice, salary man husband ASAP. Either that or just find a husband ASAP. But no man is going to consider supporting a 13 year old girl with 2 younger siblings. Then I don’t know the details, but later she marries an alcoholic, which ends up draining her emotionally and financially. Anyway, fast foward some 15-20 odd years and we’re here today. Life gets crazy it seems.

At my current position in life, I can only stand in awe of some of the lives of my elders and hope that I can find as much resilience and courage in my time of need as some of you.

It seems you learned an important lesson from your mother - it’s not the situation you’re in, it’s what you make of the situation. Some people couldn’t imagine taking care of one child alone, let alone three children. Your mother is an amazing person.

As for the interview questions, I had the opportunity to manage several interviews for a position in the company I was working at and aside from their technical/artistic skills, our #1 question was “Will he get along with the current staff?” In fact, you could say that it was possibly our #1 criteria of judgment. There were candidates that we turned down simply due to their personality not being a good fit for our company. Some of them were also under qualified, but there were certainly a few qualified individuals who we did not offer the position because of their personality. Some of the questions were aimed at getting a better picture of how this person acts/thinks in a given situation…essentially, their preferred method of socializing. Are they more quiet? Talkative? Etc..

On pheromone related note, why do you recommend a314 to Daedelus? What is it about the similarity in character/personality/behavior that makes you recommend a314?

I know that I don’t have specific people in mind that I would suggest a314 to. I do know, however, that I do not recommend it to people that do not have good social awareness. I was thinking that perhaps you recommended it to daedelus because you believe that your similar backgrounds may lend itself to greater development in social awareness?

The reason why I ask this is because I was a very quiet child. I would often be taken to long and boring (at the time) art openings and would either have my nose in a book or just watching the people talk and act. If I had been a more social child, I would not have had the opportunity to observe as many social interactions, as I would become the subject of observation. However, due to this, I remained an observer at school and many other social settings. It wasn’t until I started playing sports and becoming a participant (an important point for any of you who are reading up on becoming PUAs or any discipline really… :roll_eyes:) that I became introduced to what it feels like to be in the interactions that I observed so carefully. In middle school I realized that I could watch people and understand, but I would totally blank out when placed in said situation. So I started actively developing that aspect of myself, while in the process also becoming a better observer.

Because of my experience and my belief that a314 requires (or at least, greatly benefits from) greater social awareness, social awareness that cannot be gained simply by being a fully engaged participant.

109

Well, I always recommend A314 to anyone who meets two basic criteria. First is a little experience with pheromones from some of the other products. Daedelus has that, and is able to analyze his interactions and speculate on what’s pheros and what are other factors. IMO, this is a necessary thing to be able to watch for the subtle effects A314 has in interpersonal relations. Second, I think all men from 20 to 50 and higher can benefit from this stuff, regardless of what position a person is in, socially, professionally, or otherwise. It’s especially useful to people who are looking to improve their current situation in whatever way.

So, based on reading what folks have to say about themselves and their phero experiences, I make a decision on whether or not they’re someone I’d emphatically recommend A314 to, and (not to put him on the spot here, :wink:) Daedelus seemed to fit the profile nicely.

Thank you for your kind words, and I agree wholeheartedly that my mother is a living saint. I need to call her as a matter of fact. All of you… call your mothers too! She’ll appreciate it. :wink:

-D4

110

I see, any thoughts on background lending itself to certain types of social development?

111

I’m sure it can. Certainly, having a parent/parents that can teach you values, regardless of what’s going on around you is a plus. On the flip side, there are many people who had absolute garbage for parents and were astute enough to notice that early on. These people are the ones who developed a drive and a vision to really rise above the bad around them. The few I know who fit that profile probably wouldn’t benefit much from A314, because their own life experiences have made them charismatic, dynamic, and likable people who also command respect.

Now, of course this is all from my own perspective as an American who has yet to step out of the country. While I’m aware of some of the ultraconservative traditions in Asian countries, I couldn’t even begin to comment on it. Likewise the general liberal traditions of Europe are beyond my scope. I used to work with a guy from Sweden and tried to have meaningful conversations with him about stuff like this, but he was a walking stereotypical European Liberal Socialist, while I’m a conservative former Republican American WASP. Without trying to hit on anyone’s socio-political viewpoints here, you can imagine how that was like. :slight_smile:

-D4

112

Well, there’s one difference between you and me right there. I’ve always been a Democrat… though I didn’t indentify as liberal since 2002. And recently I’ve just considered myself more a pragmatist-with-liberal tendencies. Less ideological.

As for the rest of that stuff, in the interest of brevity… I’ll just say I have no idea how socially aware I am. Read my reports some time and judge for yourself. A314 is something I’ve considered, but mostly for really important stuff (a job interview, for instance).. I’ve had a lifetime of living with an authoritarian father (well, he’s not so bad now days), and I loathe authoritarian/VIP types, I much prefer people who let everybody share than somebody who hogs all the cookie. I definitely don’t want to become one. I’d rather be loved than feared and remembered as a good friend rather than a good leader.

113

Ridin’ Dirty, eh? Sounds like a good name for a Dirty/P83/P86/P80 mix…

114

I try not to label anyone, myself included. Too many stupid arguments have been sparked by “You’re a rightwinger!? You gun-toting redneck!” and “You’re a liberal? You treehugging commie!” I only mention my leanings and the Swedish guy’s to explain why our conversations usually didn’t get off the ground. I should also have mentioned that no matter the topic, it would always turn political, and frankly, I try to avoid discussing the merits or faults of any political side. Creates too much bad blood when people should otherwise be able to get along just fine. Doesn’t matter who you want for president. This goes for everyone.

Tater- Hehe… well, haven’t really been ridin’ anything lately, but I might be going out tomorrow night. Hopefully I can get back into the swing of things.

-D4

115

Swedish guy was probably trying to push your buttons, or you were pushing his. For some reason this always happens between Europeans and Americans, to some degree. I lived in the UK for four years and saw this happen alot, especially among the younger adults. I think it mostly comes down to misunderstanding… deep down your typical WASP American and your average northern European aren’t that different, in fact they are embarrassingly similar. But the political differences tend to obscure this.

116

From my experiences, stereotypically, Americans are somewhat viewed as being unaware of true political climates and/or playing strong favorites politically as well as committing immoral acts themselves while actively condemning others…er something like that. I’m not sure. I’m an American. :stuck_out_tongue:

As for the authoritarian business..I don’t know what it is, but I have a HUGE problem with authority. Classic punk rock, fuck the system stuff. But I’m just not actively displaying my resistance. I’ll play nice until you try and fence me in, at which point I can’t take the authority and I snap somehow.

Uhm, but that aside, I don’t feel like that when I wear a314. I don’t feel that I am imposing my will upon someone. You certainly could with a314 if that was your intention, but that lies in the behavior of the user. I think you would be alright, if you don’t want to be an authoritative person, you don’t have to be. And a good leader needs to know how to be a good friend.

117

During the first twenty two years of my life, I was extremely conservative. Now I’m semi-liberal. Mostly, I’m a contrarian. Once the thinking of the country starts floating to one side of the political spectrum, I start shifting to the other side.

Now that the winds are blowing left, I’ve already noticed myself shifting right.

I don’t think I’d enjoy the benefits of A314. I’ve always needed people to like me more than I’ve needed them to respect me. Call it the “Michael Scott” syndrome.

118

That’s not quite what I meant by “authoritarian” (and BTW I am unapologeticly not a fan of punk rock). My idea of authoritarian is somebody who believes that everyone else is usually or always wrong, and their opinion alone is legitimate. It’s closer to an “obsessive compulsive personality”. The leadership style is usually based on coercion, “do this because I am the boss”. These types of people are also usually very uncomfortable dealing with emotions in themselves or other people, too.

119

You should try one of the MX sprays based off A314 and decide for yourself- don’t take my word for it. It may not have that reaction to you.

As I said, I’m worried about authoritarian tendencies because I was raised by one… there’s probably a bit of that in me somewhere. An authoritarian is somebody that doesn’t care what you have to say, becaues you are automaticly wrong. They typically aren’t so interested in other peoples feelings, either, and usually try to motivate people by coercion or demeaning them. They are uncomfortable with feelings, period, and are often highly emotionally represssed (did you watch that A&E show on the killer accountant- he wa a really repressed guy that just snapped and killed his whole family because he was a “failure” and subconsciously resented them). “Obsessive compulsive personality” is the clinical term.

120

Oh, I’ll definitely take some blame there. Over time, we got to know eachother’s hot buttons, and when the conversations got a little too confrontational, each of us would in turn nuke the other. It did well to shut us both up, “reboot the room”, so to speak, and concentrate on the work at hand. :smiley:

Oh, and just for the record, while I am social conservative about a lot of things, whatever political activism I may get involved in centers around my fiscally conservative beliefs. It’s a much more relatable topic that a lot of people feel strongly about, conservative or liberal. Good example: I’ve got a friend who is staunchly pro abortion (This is an EXAMPLE, folks… let’s not let this one point spark a debate that could get ugly, please!), pro gun control, and has this personal crusade against “Big Oil”. At the same time, he is adamantly against socialized wealth redistribution, excessive government spending, and pork. Essentially, he’s fiscally conservative, regardless of his social views. It’s kind of funny right now. We both dislike George Bush. He calls him a warmonger, and I retort with “Yeah, well he’s blowing all our money like a Democrat!” All in good fun, of course. :wink:

-D4