i totally see how tigerlily came to an instant dislike of PUA.
it comes from being exposed to a relating that we, as women, were never meant to understand totally.
its like telling men to understand why its so important to tie yourself down to one woman imediately and make babies…
thats totally exaggerated, but you get my point.
women relate to women,men to men.
trying to figure out how we all come to similar conclusions causes headaches.
i totally agree we are hot-wired differently.
and BTW this hotwiring changes in both genders sometimes ,
none of it has to be permanant.
i remember when i was younger i actually experienced the opposite of what we read here-
i couldnt shake a guy off me
and all i really wanted was to experience life to the fullest without answering to anyone.
now
all i really want is to answer to one guy.
my first exposure to PUA
was reading posts about tricking gals into thinking you are something that you are not.
saying anything you can say to get to where you are going.
i never got the full knee-jerk reaction most women have with PUA because i believe women intuitively know when they are getting BS’d and choose to believe whatever strokes their ego as well.
i dont buy into the victim role totally.
my only disgust with PUA (a few years back )
was the eagerness and willingness to lie…
and then
teach others to be dishonest as an artform.
nomatter what the rewards for lying,
its still dishonesty that we all have to answer for and experience eventually.
dishonesty to steal is just a different reward
im all for guys relating and learning from other guys how to not place too much value on outward appearances because a beautiful woman is no better than them.
i think its natural for both genders to be intimidated by anyone they feel is more beautiful.
obviously beauty is relative (in the eyes of…).
anyone who believes beauty is a science doesnt see what i see in the bar biz.
i think its awesome that there is material out there that speaks to men about their own esteem,
that is helpful in feeling better about themselves- there is no better feeling in the whole freaking world than feeling successful.
if having many beautiful women over the course of a lifetime is anyones measure of success,
then they are totally entitled to experiencing that success and enjoying life to the fullest.
this is what i love about some of the PUA material.
feeling good is what life boils down to.
if giving women a “value” is helpful in getting an idea across, then do it.
if i am a “3” , so be it.
its about relating the idea to other men,
not to the women who happen to be reading it and cant apply it to their own situation.
as long as i dont have to KNOW about it,
LOL, then have fun.
to me its the same thing as meeting anyone for the first time
(girl or guy) and thinking
“jerk”
or
“bitch”
simply put-
label me a word or a number,
but the only one missing out is the person who doesnt see past whatever.
girls do the same thing in a different way with different agendas.
i first heard about him through Coast to Coast.
he blew me away.
he was on i believe with Linda Moulton Howe and the conversation about disclosure and real experiences and cover-ups had me glued.
he now fronts
The Disclosure Project<FONT face=“Verdana, Arial, Helvetica,
sans-serif” size=2> is a nonprofit research project working to fully disclose the facts about UFOs, extraterrestrial intelligence, and classified advanced energy and propulsion systems. We have over 400 government, military, and intelligence community witnesses testifying to their direct, personal, first hand experience with UFOs, ETs, ET technology, and the cover-up that keeps this information secret.
I want to try the quad - blue label - just did not get around to it last night although it was my original first choice though … should have gone with that.
I was never offended by anything you said. Maybe some happy faces and stuff would have altered that view if you thought it. I didn’t think it at all about any of your posts .
Yes I was absolutely mad when TigerLilly took my words to mean something that I wrote not to mean. I felt the whole PUA label was misused and uncalled for and as such I vented my objections. Those who know me know very well I hold no grudges. We are both adults and as such we will have times when we disagree. I harbor no ill will towards her.
While I understand that other molecules might overcome a persons shyness, or labeling, in this instance I was very much interested in TAH and still am. I’m not very shy around ladies, so I make a poor subject. Wonder if I can find a volunteer for this.
I am very perplexed as to how and why you personally became so defensive with this post. I never was attacking you personally, or addressing this post to you as an individual in any way. I actually have read your blog and yes, was aware that you were not an active PUA anymore.
I gave up on the forums last night. Something seemed to be in the water. Emotions ran way high and multiple messages were misconstrued and garbled across the board. Now, in relation to your post, multiple people came away from your first post probably a bit confused and not thinking what you clearly meant to say, as you expanded upon in a later post. First Wrlly seemed to come away from your post understanding that you meant spraying TAH as a way to get a disrespect self effect:
And then diane999, back to “devalueing”:
Later on, you expanded greatly, but please understand that I was not the only one to understand your meaning this way, at least initially. Diane, who is a mental ninja, was able to really get to the core of what you were saying and then analyze the deeper meaning behind the deeper meaning. But that’s her and her sheer brilliance at work. She operates on a level far different than many many of us here. She’s clearly out of my league!
It took a while to us to get to this point - Diane was the mental ninja who brought it out. Thank you, Diane.
Actually, this is what you said, and what I read that lead me to my thought process:
You said it much better above, in my opinion. I couldn’t wrap my head around the latter statement. I identified it with similar PUA statements made by others on the boards, and in other places. There was never a personal statement or accusation towards you. I was attempting to understand this thought process through what I know is a common male thought process to some of the board, and at least at one time was a thought process of yours.
Reading on, I read that you were attempting to clarify your own thought process here:
Gotcha, Gotcha… I agree actually, value should never be placed on someone via looks alone. It should be inherent, already given, already freely understood that everyone has a beautiful value…
And that’s where you lost me.
We have a fundamental difference in opinion regarding people interacting with people, and about how you approach someone (removing all PUA and sexual connotations for the moment) as an individual.
Not at all! In fact, I readily acknowledged the good aspects of Game here:
And Wrlly said something that I quite liked as well:
Once again, my comparison to game and PUA was an attempt to understand the thought process in relation to a man’s understanding of it. Your initial attempt to state your point was a bit muddled and confusing.
Clearly not. I do not know where you get that. ALL people, regardless of looks, should be approached with honest, loving respect for their inherent value. (which is always present, imo.)
You’ve explained yourself much better here and in other places now, however, I still believe that approaching anyone with a belief they haven’t earned any value is what is driving our disagreement.
Sure thing, here you go:
I never said you personally said any of this. Once again, I am mystified as to why you took my reply so personally. It was never addressed to you. You posted on an open forum, in a journal which has basically become a bar lounge for several of us, and I threw my .02 cents in. That’s the spirit of Lor’s journal. In addition, I thought you would appreciate, or at least understand the posting and interplay, since you very often state that this is a great forum, where everyone can post and disagree, and still be friends.
Right here:
That’s where I got that. Please understand that I was not the only one - Wrlly also pulled the “disrespect self effect” from your post. Please see above.
I think we have a fundamental disagreement, but more than that, I think we had a communication error.
I think that was rampant yesterday.
Regarding your friend:
I will echo Diane - I think that’s a therapy problem, not a pheromone problem. Hope he can work it out, truly.
@Lor - I don’t have an instant dislike for PUA. I acknowledge the good aspects, and really feel that building self confidence and esteem is a beautiful thing. If PUA can help a man do that, that’s fabulous. However, I do think that PUA can also turn on you - your confidence and self esteem can come from a place outside yourself too easily. It can, but not always, be dependent on what you feel you “picked up.” You may value yourself based on your skills or game, when you should be valuing yourself on you. Like I said, that’s not my overriding view of it, but it remains why I am wary of it.
Hey can I ask how much Tommy Fever was dosed in? IG and TAH, but in want amounts?
I’ve been really wanting to test out TAL and TAH, but every time I save up a little money for ordering some, something else (Raw power pack for instance) sweeps in and drains all my savings…
Someday. This TAH stuff sounds really “nice” I like friendly mixes a lot.
At what dose do you recommend this diane? I’m sure your dose will be different from a certain dosage for a guy, but do you think 12.5mcg is an OK amount to buy? Hm, I wonder what this mixed with IO, and IH would feel like.
Will have to try the P91 alone first of course, to get its own feel for it. However, it sounds like it would be a good mix with IO, and IH.
I am bouncing in my seat, skipping down the hallways and generally acting like a silly 5 year old. I am SO ridiculously happy. Everyone around me is happy too. I am singing at my desk too, pencil dancing and desk discoing, dude…! Whoo Hooo!
I was just asked to help “fix” a copier. My standard fix is to kick it, hard, until it works. (Works every time!)
Well, I did, and then we devolved into the giggles - over and over again.
Another coworker just walked by whistling the Barnum & Bailey circus theme.
Whoo Hooo!