Good point!
up to a certain point… and for a certain length is the big astericks…
wasn’t it time magazine that said in the 80’s that women over 30 have a better chance of being killed by terrrorists than being married(they later changed that b/c nowadays you are a lot more likely to get killed by terrorists and marriage is so easy)
also divorce rates are 51%…so yes you can…but for how long?
also..women outnumber men in the world…in my metropolitan city alone there are 10,000 more women than men, assuming there are equal numbers of homosexuals for both genders…that still means that thousands of women will be left without a partner no matter what.
tisha, i think the view you have of women only applies to a certain minority, those few who for whatever reason are considered the most diserable and can do whatever they want..what about the rest?
basically yes…but i don’t think that chump or feminized is the right view…it’s more of an emotional envolvement…i wrote in another topic how the more time a guy spends on a female, the more emotionally important she becomes to him…that’s why players can shrug off a women without missing a beat while a guy who gets dumped after a long term relationship have been known frequeantly to resort to alchohol and depression
Players… meh… boring.
People that don’t or can’t invest emotionally… what can you say? I don’t want them in my life… they are like bathtubs with no plug in them… what is the point in investing anything in hungry little buggers that are never satisfied? Where is the reward in it?
There is a lasting satisfaction in being involved with and investing in people who are willing to also invest in you. And I’m not just talking about intimate relationships.
Players, not just those who prey on women, but those who are any kind of posers, are con artists. You have to be to get what you want with investing the minimum energy for the maximum rewards. They are betrayers by nature. I feel exactly the same about women who are social climbers and gold-diggers. They are players too.
I just don’t understand how anyone can identify themselves as a player and be proud of it.
Diane
Not really because I feel every person is desirable to someone. Everyone has different tastes and preferences. I just think there are many women who do not realize the advantage they have. Talking strictly sex… Send a average or even below average looking women into the mall with a sign that says sign up here is you want to be my fuck buddy and that sign would fill rapidly. Not so for a man. Send a man in with the same sign and I am sure they will get a few hits but not nearly as much as the women and it will probably cost the males something.
Talking on a emotional level…
Diane is right, 80% of men are monogamous and looking for a stable connection with someone. Most men grow up and look past the package to whats inside. They want the same thing as many women.
Still when it comes down to it its easier for the women who is below a 8 then it is for a man who is below a 8 ( I hate to use the number label but its the only way I can get my point across.) we have a easier time connecting emotionally because we are not as visual as men. We look for those connections beyond the package. 34% of single females over 40 are dating men years younger then themselves though. This number has gone up tremendously since the 70’s and 80’s, the tides are turning.
The best of both worlds 
Well we are not in the 80’s anymore and those numbers are probably higher now but your assuming that every women over 30 wants marriage. Those numbers are higher not because women cant find willing men but because women don’t have the need to marry as prior generations of females did. Even in the younger generation of women (the 20 somethings) they are waiting to marry longer by choice not because they cant find a man.
If you look at the numbers now its the women leaving the men. In the 80’s it was the other way around. Women are just not as dependant on men as we used to be in our mothers generation. Yes we still are emotional and look for those connections but we don’t have to marry to make them. We are more sexually expressive as well then prior generations.
Quite a few of my female friends don’t want to get married. They make more money then the males at least in our area. They have emotional connections with friends. They have what they call “friends with benefits” were they can get sexual needs taken care of and nope they don’t have to pay them. Some of them even have children without being married. They are independent and happy this way. Hell my best friend is a Male and yes my husband knows him. We connect on a emotional level all the time. I am committed to my husband though so sex is not a issue but if I asked I know he would LOL. You dont have to be married to connect with another person nor do you have to have sex to do it.
Don’t get me wrong either I love being married and I love the institution of marriage. I love my husband but I am here because I want to be and so is he. Not because either of us has to be here. We chose to make that effort and commitment. Its work, Its effort, its taking that emotional risk.
Edit to add…
Di makes a excellent point. I feel much the same about players except I will add that I see them as inferior to most other men. My point is that women can be players as well and its much easier for them to do so because we have something you want and is not available without effort. (Which brings us back to the origonal subject on hookers)
Men also have something women want and while most women prefer men who can make that effort and commitment we can get what we want much easier from you then you can for us. Its unfortunate but a fact of life and I am not downing men. I love men and I think to many of them sell themselves short.
I am not saying because women have the ability they should use it though. I think every human deserves respect and to find what it is that makes them happy. Whether that is single or married.
Tisha
A well-written post that elides over some basic differences in the natures of men and women. There is not only the question of the difference in the nature of infidelity that hurts more for each sex - emotional vs sexual - but also gender differences in susceptibility to behaving differently in hot vs cold mental states.
tisha, as i read your post, there are certain words that pop out…
advantage..tides turning…don’t have the need to marry…independent
i would have to be an idiot not to recognize that you have a very feminist view…this reminds me of an article i used for school:
Fetching Jen: Lonely Feminists
the advantage in sex you refer to..i believe it’s called "pussy power"lol
but here’s the thing..how useful is it tho? yes you can have sex whenever you want with however many guys you want…but who would wanna settle down with a slut? (yes i know double standard and all)
everybody is waiting to marry later..not just women that’s the nature of the modern world.
yes most divorces are initiated by women now but why? because men suck? or because women don’t need men? or because women don’t know how to pick a good man? or because they’re aren’t that many good men to go around? i don’t know…
i support equality but i don’t support feminism (are you scratching your head yet?) i view feminism as a very narrow and irresponsible philosophy…dating is the most blatant example i can give…
the women’s lib movement gave women the power to do whatever they wanted to in the dating world..but didn’t teach them how to do it.
now before you feel like you wanna cut my nuts off, please look at this video: YouTube - How Feminism Screwed my Generation
yah, this guy sounds angry cause he just lost his girlfriend, but please see the whole thing thru…he has some amazing insights into the modern day dating world and people’s psychology.
meow333x
tisha, as i read your post, there are certain words that pop out…
advantage..tides turning…don’t have the need to marry…independent
i would have to be an idiot not to recognize that you have a very feminist view…this reminds me of an article i used for school:
Fetching Jen: Lonely Feministsthe advantage in sex you refer to..i believe it’s called "pussy power"lol
but here’s the thing..how useful is it tho? yes you can have sex whenever you want with however many guys you want…but who would wanna settle down with a slut? (yes i know double standard and all)everybody is waiting to marry later..not just women that’s the nature of the modern world.
yes most divorces are initiated by women now but why? because men suck? or because women don’t need men? or because women don’t know how to pick a good man? or because they’re aren’t that many good men to go around? i don’t know…
i support equality but i don’t support feminism (are you scratching your head yet?) i view feminism as a very narrow and irresponsible philosophy…dating is the most blatant example i can give…
the women’s lib movement gave women the power to do whatever they wanted to in the dating world..but didn’t teach them how to do it.now before you feel like you wanna cut my nuts off, please look at this video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rWR1Z4AiyWM
yah, this guy sounds angry cause he just lost his girlfriend, but please see the whole thing thru…he has some amazing insights into the modern day dating world and people’s psychology.
I don’t quite get your point. What exactly are you trying to say?
You say, “double standard”?? Does that mean you think women should want to settle down with a philanderer (male slut). I think any woman who would give a second thought for a guy who can’t keep his dick in his pants is an idiot. I also think any guy who would knowingly marry a slut is also an idiot.
If you are a philanderer or a slut more power to you. Have fun! It’s a shallow life, but whatever. Just go fuck each other and be honest about what you are.
Don’t lie to those of us who find that behavior appalling. Don’t try to make us believe you are other than what you are. Stop breaking our hearts. And don’t expect us to raise your children.
What is so hard about that?
Diane
diane, i don’t advocate the player lifestyle nor do i consider myself one, but you have to understand also that men and women are playing by different rules to get to the same goal. what do i mean by this? well for women the game is attraction, for men the game is conquer. let me try to draw an analogy to try to explain myself better..
as a women, when you were a kid, you really didn’t care about your looks
then as a preteen you maybe started to match your tops with bottoms
then as a late teen got really into makeup and jewelry
then as an adult got it really down to where your left ear ring had to somehow match the bottom of your right foot and you even knew how to flirt.
this would be the womens’ progression: making yourself more and more attractive in order to get the best possible mate you can.
now men on the other hand…our progression is a little different…
we lost our virginity to whoever we can
then maybe we try to seduce someone we’re not attracted to just to get some seduction skills under our belt
then we move onto someone we are somewhat attracted to
then we move onto someone we are really attracted to, both physically and everything else.
this would be the man’s progession: each time conquering a better woman until we end up with the woman of our dreams.
yes i know i’m using lame ass sterotypes and a lot of assumptions..if you’re gonna point this out then you totally missed the point.
I thought I should reply to this, because I know tons of people will jump in and say “no, you should lose your virginity so someone you love and care about”, even if they lost their virginity in high school. But that option has certain prerequisites. Namely, you gotta be the type of guy/man who can easily attract a girlfriend. A lot of times, it includes driving a cool car, being good-looking, knowing how to pick-up girls, and having a lot of “confidence”. If you got all these traits, let me congratulate you. But for the rest of us, we gotta do what meow333x pointed out, and lose the V-card to whoever we can. Sometime it’s a person we love, but other times, it isn’t. And it doesn’t have to be.
yuppers…see a lot of misunderstandings arise from women not being able to understand what it’s like being a man…
it’s been said that 10% of men date 80% of women…so women naturally assume certain things…err better word would be project certain things about men…
i’ve been told by women “well why don’t you just go pick someone up at a bar?” really? it’s that simple? lol
they have no idea how few guys can actually do that…how could they? thier only experience is being hit on 20 times a night at a bar.
it’s been said that dating is a choice for women and a chore for men
i don’t think i’ve ever met any woman, even lesbians, or mothers that even remotely understand that concept
ok lets get this thread back on track…
which do you think is better for a man to shoot for?
an average paying job that leaves him time to chase women, or a high paying job that affords him lots of hookers?
LOL I suggest you look at some more of my posts on this board before you make that judgement. I call them like I see them and I am not a feminist by a long shot.
Hey I didn’t say it was right I said it was a fact of life and one that is of men’s own doing. Its males very behavior that gives women the power to use sex to get what they want.
Well from the statistics its because women are more independent and don’t need a man to take care of them anymore so they are less likely to put up with the bullshit.
Again its obvious you don’t really know me like most of the long time members here do. I have been preaching about equality and respect for both men and women on this forum for years. Feminist I am not. I have respect for the Alpha male. The male who can stand up and say this is what I want and how I want it and knows how to get it without being a male whore getting it. The man brave and confident enough to take the emotional risk. To many men looking to blame others and not look at there own behavoir out there.
I do think he has been hurt, and confused and clearly is a whiny beta male but besides that he makes some good points many which I stated above but of course when a women points out those same things she is a slut or a feminist. Keep in mind above I stated what is happening out there not my philosophy on how it should be or what I believe in.
I think his problem is he looks at the world as the men against the women and should focus more on people as individuals with individual needs and wants. Just because one persons set of values or needs doesn’t match his doesn’t make them wrong. It just makes them wrong for him. Love and life doesn’t come with a instruction manual or a set of rules. Not for this generation and not for any of the past ones.
Oh please…LOL I think a lot of men don’t understand what its like to be men. Are you saying men know what its like to be a women ? I have been married a long time and have two sons who are both Alpha’s and don’t seem to have these problems.
Now isn’t that just what I explained in my above post ?
See this is what I mean, no offense but your contradicting yourself We know what we want and how to get it (not just by sex either) the problem is men have always wanted " there cake and to eat it to" and they are pissed because women have moved up to a point where “we can have our cake and eat it to” and they cant deal with it. Its a fact of life not a personal opinion of mine.
The one that makes him the happiest and most fulfilled which will be different for each man.
Yes try again because I don’t get your point. Seems like your trying to justify why men sleep with so many women and your view of young women is very shallow.
Tisha
Is this the kind of crap you guys tell each other?
You need to understand that there are two kinds of people, sluts and people who aren’t sluts - it has nothing to do with gender and everything to do with focus.
While most people who ended up being sluts were focusing on how to lose their virginity and who to fuck next (both guys and gals) the rest of us (guys and gals) were busy making friends, building social networks, studying our classes and trying to get good grades, and trying to figure out what to do with our lives,… and, yes, dating!
This bullshit about tops and pants is pure crap, used to justify what you are. But you know what. You don’t need to lie to yourself or to me. You don’t need to justify yourself. You are okay as you are.
Instead of trying to convince everyone that all men are like you, and all women are not like you, (sluts are sluts are sluts) just admit what you are, a slut. I don’t care. It won’t make me like you any less. And it would be honest.
Diane
ok this is turning into an argument really fast but…
“Well from the statistics its because women are more independent and don’t need a man to take care of them anymore so they are less likely to put up with the bullshit.”-something about this isn’t making sense to me..isn’t it the woman’s decision to get into the relationship in the first place? so a woman chooses to get with a man then chooses to get out of it because she doesn’t wanna put up with the bullshit? huh???
and please explain what you mean by “have your cake and eat it too” about men. this is the first time i’ve ever heard that phrase to describe men.
“your view on young women is very shallow”
-please enlighten me then
you mentioned that your husband and two sons are all alphas and that i have a shallow view of women…anyone else see the irony in this?
i’m gonna have to disagree with you on this just based on personal experience…i have 5 friends that would fit your definition of sluts..but guess what.. 4 of them had no intention of being anything like that..so what happened? well they had bad relationships and decided at some point in their lives (early 20’s mostly) that the only way they would get a decent woman is to “play the field”
wow
is there any chance we can get back to talkin about prostitues please?
Having your cake and eating it to is a phrase for a person who wants everything his or her way.
In this situation what I am referring to is men want to be able go out screw whomever they want whenever they want and us little sweet girls will just sit on the side lines and wait for you to notice us and forgive you all because its in your nature.
What I mean by “Tides are turning” is that the younger generation of women are now going out and doing what they want, whenever they want and some of the men are ending up watching from the sidelines waiting to be noticed and they are a little pissed the shoe is on the other foot now and they don’t like the fit.
Again not saying it right or wrong. Its just the way I see it.
I will say this though. Alpha up and get out there and do something about it. Because the way I see it, women only treat the beta males the way that guy was describing in the you tube video you posted.
Well ultimately its both partners who decide even though women can manipulate men into a relationship easier. I assume if a women leaves a male its because some bullshit is going on because if they were in a caring relationship they would be no reason to leave. So yes they leave from what ever bullshit is occurring in the relationship.
My mothers generation looked the other way when it came to abusive men or cheating men. They had no choice. Not today’s women though. Again before you scream feminist I am just stating facts not my beliefs.
I have to laugh because I am just stating everything guys have been whining about in this forum for years and you are the one arguing not me.
Go back and read what I wrote.
Yes its easier for the women so don’t feel sorry for us. LOL
Now go on back and talk about hookers if you want but don’t ask questions unless you prepared to hear answers
Tisha
i’ve always thought that was messed up. basically i think there should be equality…both should either be monogamous or both should be totally out there.
i agree with you on this…the role reversal…women didn’t like it then and men don’t like it now. but the point i was trying to make is that this isn’t the most ideal condition…wheather men are in charge or women are…a power imbalance is a shithole for society no matter who’s holding the reins.
But isn’t giving up because of setbacks a beta trait? Alpha’s never give up.
And what was the cause of the bad relationships? Was it betrayal by their woman by any chance?
Diane