I would like some clarity and understanding please…
I have come across Mobocaster advicing the meeting and no contact approach to develop fallout…etc.
I am paraphrasing but I just want to understand the psychology of this and if this happens even without mones.
Like why does this happen ?, what is the reasons? and I remeber coming across that the woman usally develops negative feeling first, can someone explain to me in more detail please?
I can understand the woman having mixed emotions but why would this happen from the mones…partically A314? … and if for example this does happen like this what would be the best approach to progress?
Does all this happen without mones still or is something greater at work here that I am missing?
And what does the meeting up and no contact approach exactly do other then create a weird limbo between meeting?
Also can doing this create fallout self effects towards the woman?
Its a strange thing but the foundations of solid and long term attraction are almost always laid in the space between contact and no contact - I can’t think of a particularly logical explanation, other than that’s just how it is.
Your question is more or less explored on this recent thread, so its well worth a read:
So if I am using 2 drops A314, 2 Ammo, 2 IS and I did not want to use IH but I am open to using P74…as I have a togo of it, would adding a couple sprays to this mix (without IH) help the mix in a bonding way?
I am thinking of giving my hands a few sprays of P74 which I know the togo is at 5mcg per spray.
If I added the P74 to the mix, would I need to add TUTH as I did when I added IH? … Or will I be ok without adding TUTH.
A314 can induce fallout all by itself yes but the IH/P74 combo brings very solid and particular emotional engagement properties and can be used on its own or alongside A314/other pheros. IH/IS is also a valuable base combo.
Personally I would try to keep Ammo to the bare minimum in many fallout mixes as I feel its alphanol is at odds with developing fallout - maybe one spray for scent consistency but that’s all. There are other mixes where you can use Ammo, Alphanol or IO more freely but they are not beginners mixes and I’d advise anyone starting out to get to grips with less potentially problematic products first.
Yes, you will probably need something like TUTH to sexualise this mix as A314/IH and A314/IH/P74 have good moderating properties, so a balanced product like Ammo just gets lost in the mix. However, regard the sexual as a secondary/steering component, for when you get into a suitable environment - don’t regard it as part of your base mix, which needs to be wearable in all situations.
Okay, so if I started using A314, IH, P74 Base mix and let’s say I go to pubs, restaurants, my place etc when meeting the woman I am seeing… could I just use A314, IH, P74 without TUTH and be ok with no none on other then what is in the A314?
With this Base mix should I only add say 2 sprays of TUTH when I want to have sex with her? What if I want to have sex everytime I see her? …it would then be part of my Base lol.
I am just trying to understand, because when I used A314, Ammo, Is and IH, you recommened me to add the TUTH… was that just because of the alphanol in the ammo?
Does A314, IH, P74 skip the attraction part and skip straight to the comfort bonding part? Or does it involve attraction in its own way… or attraction is assumed already thus just moving onto deeper emotional bonding stuff?
Sorry if this is a bad time for me to come in with my first post. I am completely new to these, though this thread is a probably a good explanation as to why I have decided to experiment, completely blind I must add, I have only noti0c0ed this great site after purchasing pherone m-11 (not sure if I should be embarrassed!)
I will be meeting up with my ex frequently as we have a child together. Very short interactions maybe 5-10 mins most. She has suddenly ‘went off me’ and I feel she is forcing herself to stay this way and move on.
I’m hoping this will add a bit of a curveball along with my fresh attitude and no more doom and gloom.
How much should I be applying? I am applying with a few sprays of tom ford afterwards.
Any tips??
Thanks, again apologies if I should be starting off somewhere else lol
restaraunts, pubs, clubs and your place are the sort of situations I would be adding a sexual - they (roughly in order) represent the more uninhibited environments where thoughts/feelings tend to move towards sex. So I’d suggest you use at least a little TUTH - you can always increase as the night goes-on and things get more determinedly sexual.
The amount of None in A314 is tiny - trace levels to help support a masculine impression. Its unlikely to work on an attraction/sexual level for most women. The very youngest maybe?
Its more sedate stuff, polite company, work, just hanging-out etc that can be difficult with a sexual signature and indeed where it can most often backfire. Stick to your base mix here.
Its a given that you want sex with her - and she knows you want sex every time you see her! All the pheros do here is help give her the mess of (often conflicting) feelings that means she’s actually going to sleep with you. Unlike men, few women respond well to full-on arousal out of nowhere (ie TUTH) in most environments. There are a lot of other feelings involved and the more of these you engage with, the better things-go.
The amount of TUTH you need depends on the results of your testing to find your sweet spot and the relative sexuality of the environment - As things unravel, you may find your dose can increase - sometimes significantly by the time you get home, when she will be well into it if you are doing things right.
No, the TUTH is to tune the sexual impact to her mood/environment. Other than a small amount of moderation, Alphanol has little bearing here, although it will have more impact on falout potential. IIRC, in you last combo, A314 was in low proportion to underline/steer the Ammo with solid attractive values, not for attraction itself - You were asking for a more immediate mix, not a long term bonding/connecting mx.
Depends on the woman - Some will tune-in to A314 on an attraction level, others can pick-up on its status/trust/connection/masculine/fatherly qualities - which are attractive and give substance to attraction. IH/P74 rounds these out in an attractive/trusting/sharing and with repeated exposure, a strongly emtionally engaging/bonding/“missing-you” way - which is very easy to drive in an attraction/sexual direction with the right supporting behaviour and sexual steering.
And if she doesn’t respond well to a314, IH/P74 is still a viable fallout combo all on its own that will still be practical moderation for TUTH.
Yeah it’s interesting as she was asking me lots on the topic of sex, and I her.
She did say to me (without me asking) that she needs to feel comfortble before she has sex with me, she said this at least twice that night… (we was at a pub, sitting on a sofa)
She also mentioned that she did not feel comfortble touching my leg or even touching my face.
After she said that I said come here (as to come in for a cuddle) she said yeah let’s cuddle.
As the night progressed she did touch me more (including my leg) and I made sure I touched her more.
By the end of the night she seemed more comfortble to touch me and more up for cuddling on her own initiative as we was leaving. (Which went into the daddy comment)
I went in for a kiss as we got outside to say our goodbyes and she went with it but then just before I was going to turn it into a snog she turned her head away.
She then playfully said “That was meant to be a peck on the cheek!” " You nearly put your tounge down my throat!"
I stayed silent… continued walking side by side and I gave her a few side by side cuddless, said our byes and she said to me “See you soon” (I asked her during the night when she’s next available)
I don’t really know what to make of it to be true, as on our prior messages she did say she wants to go with the flow.
My plan is to go with the flow, I just wanted to see what she would do if I kissed her.
That’s all good - and in some ways she’s shit-testing you by telling you all the things you need to do to put her right-off sex with you.
So you need to wrong-foot her a bit, see that she’s not too comfortable around you and that there is an edge/bit of tension between you. So don’t be afraid to stir the pot a bit - kino is good but she needs to catch her breath at you in other ways, just enough to remind her she’s got a red-blooded man by the tail here, not a purring pussycat in her lap. So don’t be afraid to challenge her emotionally/intellectually and push the envelope a bit physically - like you did with the kiss. Always take just a little more than she’s ready to give - Of course if she shuts you down completely, do respect that and pull right back from her - she will almost certainly rush back into the gap if you step back without contacting/validating her.
TUTH will help you here - for sexual tension, and it will impact on her perception of genuinely attractive behaviour traits.
P74 will help make other aspects of you comfortable and cuddly but not too much as you don’t want to be just cuddly. 20-30 mcg (depending on how much TUTH) should be your upper ceiling.
IH will help moderate the TUTH and with P74, it gives the kind of connection that is great for those “it was just meant to happen” feelings - which are great at taking things to the next level.
How much A314 are you using? “Not cuddly” is something you can get if your siga is too high status around a woman. Maybe reduce your dose or even consider just IH/P74 instead. YOu may also want to look-into some P83 for disinhibition - round 10mcg per spray is a good start and 20-40 mcg will probably be the working range for the sort of mix you are using.
And reduce your talks in the night - it helps both your attractive qualities and your phero sig sink-in if she has to wait a bit to hear from you. Also do your very best to avoid relationship/go with the flow type talks - she needs to get herself into the frame of mind where she is pressing for a relationship not you. So cultivate other options (or at least appear to) and don’t jump too high/too fast when she throws-out relationship-like feelers. Its totally counterintuitive but its the way this works - the more she knows she has you where she wants you, the less she will value you as a potential partner.
Yeah that last paragraph I need to work on because she has been separated for 3 years from her husband and she got out of a relationship 3 weeks ago, as she said she lost attraction for the guy.
There seems so many little things that I can write here that could change the way it seems. There are times where I am confused in how to play it because of the mixed messages.
But I mean I feel that there is sexual tension there because I told her to stop looking at my crouch a few times and we spoke explicitly about sex.
And she asked me how do I deal with my sex drive, and asked if I am causally seeing other women. I did not really answer the question (As I know she ended her marriage because he cheated on her) and I just said I don’t like one night stands that is all you need to know)
I seem mysterious to her, as I have not told her much about my life (The ins and outs) so she don’t really know if I am seeing any other women, or if I am not. I am not on Facebook so she has no clue what I get up to really. Only what I tell her.
Last time I saw her I text her the following morning about some random dream I had of her and I have not spoke to her all week (She had plans all this week) When I last saw her she said she might be able to see me this following week coming up and she will let me know.
I was going to see if she gets in contact with me, as I really do not want to chase, that is what it kind of feels like, as she has never asked me to meet up it has always been me and she has always said yes to meeting up and DOES makes time for me.
I do feel like I am the one ‘‘chasing’’ not sure if that is the correct word. I think I would understand more if she took more of an initiative but then again there is apart of me that don’t expect that until after we have had sex.
Last time we met I used 2 drops A314 royal, 2 ammo (f21) and 1 spray x2 IS.
Maybe next time I will use the same but add a spray of TUTH to my hands to add more sexual tension, I can always wash it of my hands…
Maybe I should drop all contact (Like I have done for the last 6 days) and see if she does get in contact with me about meeting up again.
I am sorting out a new apartment to move into, so I can’t extaly take her back to mine yet. But if I was already moved in I would get her back to mine straight away and I am pretty sure she would as the second time I met her after that she did say maybe we can come back to yours next time for a cup of tea.
So, soon as I move in, she will get her ass in there. So sexual tension has to rise…
Ok well it sounds like you are chasing her. I have done the same thing in the past. I would just go dark, let her contact you, this will help with the tension. This will also help you look non-needy which is important to many women. What I would do is move into your apartment and just realax and take it easy, do your own thing and if she contacts you then great if not, then there are more women out there.
My concern is make sure you don’t turn into just a rebound. This is a personal opinion that people do not give themselves enough time to get over the last relationship, and when that baggage is left it bleeds into the next one.
I’m sure you know all of this Stud, just be yourself and many times things will fall into place. If you try to force it you will lose her for sure.
I just need to find that fine line between pursuing her and letting her come to me, as I do enjoy the challenge as that is what it feels like to me. But at the same time I can easily just walk away and never look back as there are plenty of women out there.
I don’t like chasing anyway, I am aware of it when I do it and I ususally stop completly and go in the opposite direction, as I am pretty stubborn lol. I think I will do that because there is apart of me that feels she should be the one chasing me if anything. I have got things to sort out anyway, so yeah I will just get on with them.
Its not surprising she’s sending mixed messages if she’s only three weeks out of a relationship - Few people are going to be ready to get back into another one wholehartedly for a good while yet.
And yes, again I would be very surprised if she’s not in a bit on a bit of a rollercoaster over sex and feelings - but don’t get drawn into long discussions about sex or relationships. These are not as good as it seems attraction-wise, they are more of a “friend” function and you don’t really want to be going there - So unless its to your advantage, avoid them.. IH/IS, plus TUTH when the time is right are a good way of driving this kind of mood into the right kind of trusting/sharing-fanasies direction.
Also be aware to the possibility that whilst she’s not likely to be wanting to pair-up for now, she could be sounding you out for a bit of no-strings sex/companionship, so if you can make that happen, all the better. This can stabilise into a more serious relationship when she’s ready.
So for now,cut back contact to the bare minimum - ideally not till she gets back in touch and then only enough to set your next meet, where you can bring your personality, body language and phero-sig to bear in all the right ways. And concentrate on having the best time you can - in the moment and not with any eye to any future relationship. She probably won’t have any shortage of guys who might want to tie her down again, so you need to be the guy who stands-out as different to all that.
She has already given some positive IOIs, so if you cut contact now, I’d expect it will stimulate her curiosity/interest and you will hear from her again.
I am thinking when she gets in contact again and she is just asking me “how are you doing” or something like “merry xmas” without mentioning “meeting up”, I will not reply. I can easily go months without contact if I wanted to, and I think it would help prevent the whole rebound thing too.
It’s just she never text me about meeting up (like we discussed when we last saw each other), so I get the feeling she might be playing a game to see if I chase her or something (I don’t know).
All I know I would rather not wast energy on all this and would rather go completely and totally dark, this would definitely show I am non needy and that I can take it or leave it and have other options.
One thing I noticed with girls is that they seem really interested in meeting you, but when the time comes it can be really hard for them to push on for a second date. I have this thing, if people are interested in meeting me, I will talk to them. If they lose interest, stop talking to me or just plain ignore me, I go on and find someone else.
There is a LOT of women that expect man to chase them, and trust me, lots of times it ended up with a rejection from their side. My current girlfriend was the opposite, she contacted me, gave me a kiss, and when I left she immediately wanted to see me again. During the second date she told me she wanted to see me more often, and loved if I stopped meeting other girls for a while so I could give her all the attention. She knows that if she wants to keep me, she has to work for it else I would start dating again. And I know that if I want to keep her too, I need to put effort in it. But if one side does not put effort in seeing each other, then it won’t work.
I would say: If she does not respond after the first date and does not want to see you again, chances are the mones did their job well, but the chemistry simply didn’t stay. I have seen a lot of women that came out smiling, wanting to kiss me, and when they left they felt ashamed and began having second thoughts. They still think about those wonderful times with their ex, and you just reminded them about it. In those cases, its better to leave them alone for a while and move on. If they want you, they will let you know soon enough. If not, then I have to say “sorry” but then I think its better to find someone else to flirt with… When they know they are not the onliest women on the earth who loves you, then they will do more effort for you then when they know you love them… because then they are basically wrapping you around their finger.
Well, she just finally messaged me…after no contact from me nor her, for 8 days.
When we was last together we discussed the possibility of meeting before Christmas and she said she will let me know. So basically tomorrow is the last possible day to meet before Christmas.
She said “Hi StudMuffin, hope you are well. Just letting you know I won’t be able to really see you before Xmas. Hope you have a good Xmas!”
What do you guys think of that giving the context of this thread?
My opinion is that if a woman wants to see you she will make time for you, no matter how busy she is. Now if she has kids or something else like that then that is understandable.
To me it seems like she is playing a game with you. The question is will you let her pull you in? There is no reason to be at her beck and call right now or ever. I would text her back “you too” and let her make the next move.
