As I’ve mentioned in a few other threads, I have an abnormally elevated testosterone level for a woman. Not so elevated that it has caused problems, but detectable via bloodtest and to the point that I was prescribed medication “just in case”. It’s been my theory that my almost daily use of copulins has caused an extreme increase in my sex drive because copulins cause an increase in testosterone in men. I have no reason to believe it doesn’t do the same for women, it’s just not easily discernable because most women don’t produce enough testosterone normally for it to be noticeable.
Well, aside from sex drive, it’s starting to become extremely noticeable for me.
I’m getting, uh, lots of single dark hairs coming in around my chin. This just started over the past month or so, so I have to believe it’s related to pheromone usage, and again my theory is copulins. I’m aware that as women enter menopause, hormone fluctuations can cause dark, stiff hairs on the face to start growing, but I’m way too young for that.
I’m going to experiment for a while, going copulin free, to see if the hair growth is halted. If my experiment proves my theory, that means it’s time to dust off my Vaniqa prescription, I guess!
Well cops do increase the testosterone in men quite a bit so it is possible they can do the same in women. I know I do feel more sexual when wearing them. could be a possible side effect for women with high testo levels
Yikes. Definitely signs of elevated testosterone. At least you haven’t had your voice drop. I’ve read that when female body builders cycle roids they don’t get that time of the month. Do keep us informed.
Women experience arousal when they produce testosterone to combine with estrogen. So your theorem with the addition of cops sounds quite logical.
That’s an interesting observation. It does seem to add weight to the evidence that copulins can affect women who have extra testosterone, in a way very similar to a man. I wonder how copulins would affect women with normal testosterone levels.
As a guy, I think large amounts tends to make me produce more androstenone exposed to it over several days in high enough amounts (1 drop to 1/2 a drop). I tend to wear a very low amount now days, if I wear any at all. No extra hair growth or anything like that, though. I eat alot of soy and other vegetables (brocolli being a favorite of mine), perhaps that has an effect on testosterone>DHT metabolism. It could be useful for you too because DHT is a more potent androgen than testosterone (saw palmetto is another herb that lowers production of DHT).
Also, I’m sure you’ve got an endocrinologist that could help you out and talk over your options with you.
It’s not like I’m becoming The Bearded Lady of Guildford or anything. To me, lots of stiff little dark hairs is 4 or 5. My mother gets this type of hair growth on her chin since entering menopause, so for that stage of life it’s not out of the ordinary (for women of certain ethnicities, at least). It’s just a little unsettling for someone in their twenties!
I was watching a show the other day which included a segment on laser hair removal where a woman had the hair on her chin removed permanently. However, it does require a couple treatments because the hair grows in cycles.
Anyway, the dermatologist doing the procedure said that she had seen a large increase in women coming to have it done on their faces because the added hormones in various meat products, specifically chicken, causes abnormal facial hair growth in women
I dont really know if that applies here but I thought I’d share
Is the testosterone levels being released in men or produced from copulins. There is a difference. Releasing means it has already been synthesised and is just ecreted into the blood, produced means you are making much more. Making more is a complex hormone imbalance which related to pituitary/adrenal/reproductive organ axis. I don’t think that pheros would increase production to excess amounts. I could be wrong but other factors may be affecting you. Weight(body fat levels), thyroid, cholesterol levels and such. But very interesting
There is already evidence that copulins increase circulating testosterone in men. Since I already have higher than normal circulating testosterone levels, it stands to reason that the same thing could be happening to me.
If the cause is some other factor, that would be a huge coincidence. I have already had a full workup done at the doctor’s office and nothing else is off balance.
BTW your name reminds me of “Dr. T and the Women”.
My understanding is that this is more likely to be DHT than testosterone, but, of course, DHT comes from testosterone so it could still be related to the high testosterone.
5-alpha-reductase (5AR) is the enzyme that converts testosterone into DHT. There are a number of herbal and prescription 5AR inhibitors. You want to find a good doctor to help you unravel what is happening her. Good luck with that! (I have DHT issues myself).
Get your DHT levels measured ASAP before you start taking anything for the problem – so you know where you are starting. If your doctor isn’t cooperative you can get your blood tested at a reasonable price through the Life Extension Foundation. They have a contract with LabCorp. Personally, I have had bad experiences with DHT testing at Quest Diagnostics. Last two times they lost the sample – only the DHT not the other bloodwork!
5AR inhibitors: Saw Palmetto extract (std. to 85%), Beta sitosterol (is in saw palmetto), zinc, Stinging Nettle ROOT (not leaf, Warning: fairly strong sedative for some people), progesterone.
Azelaic acid (20% prescription strength) applied topically reduces DHT in the folicles. It is prescribed for acne.
Prescription 5AR inhibitors include finasteride (proscar, propecia) and dutasteride (avodart). Finasteride is a 5AR type 2 inhibitor. Type 2 is found primarily in the prostate. Hair folicles contain primarily 5AR type 1. Dutasteride is a type 1 and type 2 inhibitor of 5AR. Unfortunately, dutasteride has a long half life and will be extremely difficult to dose for someone like you. Some men report success applying it topically (for male pattern baldness), but no doctor is likely to condone that. Hopefully, saw palmetto will be enough for you.
People! I know you are trying to be helpful here, but please reread my first post. My testosterone level is not a new problem, it is something I have been seeing doctors about for some time.
Relax, everyone. I’m not in need of diagnosis. I just thought I would alert women that persistent use could cause something like this.
I’m thinking about deleting this thread because it has derailed from an FYI to internet diagnosis, which was not my intention. I don’t want anyone to happen upon this without already being under a doctor’s supervision and think they can treat themselves based upon what is being discussed.
Thank you ariadne, the information you’ve provided has been extremely helpful and I’m glad you posted. As for me I am unsure of my testosterone levels, but am sure that it I have a dht problem because my hair is slightly thinning. As much as I love copulins because they work like a charm I am definitely cutting back on super high amounts and saving them on the weekends or special days and just using other pheromones like instant openness and honesty on regular days. It’s a good thing there’s a huge selection here. Not saying that trace amounts are bad, but I was putting eow in everything. My cut back on copulin use encourages me to experiment with the other things we have here.
I think you should just relax. There’s a certain amount of personal responsibility involved in being an adult and making decisions for yourself and your health. Besides, offering advice is also a way of showing concern or empathy as well.
And, while I don’t want to needlessly deter people from seeking out competent medical advice, doctors are not some priestly class with special arcane knowledge- perhaps this is a more masculine point of view, though, since we tend to go to doctors lesn than women. They are human beings with training, limited knowledge, and can make mistakes and oversights. Some medical treatmets that are routine in the US are of questionable medical value and/or overused, and doctors as a whole can be very consevative and compartmentalized in their thinking and practice.
I am not offering you a diagnosis, Ariadne. I am not a doctor, nor have I examined you.
What I am offering you is my knowledge of a closely related area. Much of this I learned on my own, the hard way – after talking to several doctors.
I am glad Ariadne has her situation under control. There may well be people drawn to this thread because of similar concerns. It is always well to know as much as possible before seeing your doctor so you can discuss a situation intelligently. There have been several occasions, after a doctor had told me all he could offer, that I had the knowledge to ask about this or that treatment he had left unmentioned. Surprisingly often his reply is that that would be good. My thoughts are always, “What am I – teaching medical school here? Who is billing whom? If it is such a good idea why didn’t you tell me, doctor?” But I usually keep my mouth shut, satisfied in the knowledge that I’m gonna get the preferred treatment afterall. Thankfully, I have doctors in the family (though out of town) so I can get free second opinions.
I am also glad that I have the wherewithall to pick up the pieces that doctors drop. I mentioned the incidient above where the doctor kept sending me to a lab that consistently lost blood samples. Finally, on my own, I got my blood drawn at a lab which could produce results. The numbers turned out to be important.
Ariadne’s testosterone is not a new problem. I hope her DHT is not a problem. For others of you with these concerns I hope my earlier post provides interesting, perhaps valuable, background material. I am not a biochemist either. Perhaps someone who did his PhD thesis on the biochemistry of 5-alpha-reductase can post some more definitive information. From what I’ve learned I have to be very sceptical that Instant Sexiness is gonna grow you a beard. Not only do you have to assume pheromones can raise testosterone that much, but you have to assume that sufficient amounts would then be converted to DHT and they would cause that reaction. Ariadne’s observation is an important contribution. I wouldn’t want it to get deleted. Who knows what we’ll learn in time, but my hope is that women aren’t unduely frightened away from Instant Sexiness if it is working well for them.
I too believe that I have a higher testosterone level for a women in her early 20s but I’m only noticing darker hairs that popped up months ago on my belly, not my face at least. Still not fun. I can’t wear a bikini to the beach anymore.
It is normal for women at your age to begin popping in a few whiskers. It is unfortunate, but a normal consequence of aging. If they bother you tremendously, you can get them laser treated and they won’t grow back.
I have read about drinking SPEARMINT tea helping people with high androgen levels though and people with PCOS, I’m going to try drinking it everyday soon.
