Not this time, baby

Field Reports & Anecdotal Experience Men's Pheromone Advice & Field Reports
1

There’s this woman I’ve been friends with for almost 20 years. There is attraction, especially when we haven’t seen eachother for a long time, a year or so. She becomes very cuddly and initiates things she then isn’t ready to follow through. On numerous occasions I’ve stripped her right down to her panties just to hear her say no at the very last moment, leaving me with blue balls of biblical proportions.

She has her reasons, none are valid in my opinion. She once was together with a mutual friend of ours, he proved to be an asshole whom neither of us have anything to do with this day, so I have no loyalty whatsoever to that piece of shit.

She and I have been friends for a long, long time. Still no reason not to fuck when both want it badly. If it leads to something deeper, great. I’d welcome a serious relationship with a sensible woman I already love as a friend, whom I find sexy and who obviously has the same feelings towards me.

If we don’t find that little extra to really fall in love, I have no problem moving on after having sex any number of times, seeing her find new guys and still remaining very good friends with her.

I also have no problem staying just friends, without sexual tension, without touching beyond hugs and slaps on the back but she’s a woman - I’m a machine. When she starts playing with my belt buckle, I ignite. You don’t just lead me into your bedroom and then walk out. Well, she’s done that a number of times and I of course respect a no at any point, but damn if I’m gonna hear that word this time.

We haven’t seen eachother in almost two years for several reasons. She contacted me a couple of weeks ago and we decided I’d come over tonight. Seeing eachother after a hiatus this long is the typical setting where she explains I’m the perfect man in every way, starts touching and kissing me, giving me wood I could tear down a brick wall with just to in the end put up resistance I just can’t get past.

Not this time, baby.

Of course I’ll use A314, I will use IH but should I settle for Ammo or go all in with Tuth?

2

EH?!

I’m guessing you guys had time to catch up before this event. Is there anything going on in her life to feel the need to hold back on a committed/sexual relationship? How did she look when she turned you down? I’m sure it may have been hard for her to do that as she was praising you and all of that good stuff…even to lead you on by taking off the belt. I find that really odd. The way she contacted you in a while may suggest she’s seeking comfort, or just misses you.

Attraction is there, but the willingness is not. What’s stopping it from happening? Event? No man on the side? Boy toy? Idk the whole situation. Religious views (lol)? Maybe she feels that having sex would lead to commitment that she’s not ready for. Esp, if you guys haven’t seen each other for a while and even if you guys knew eachother for 20 years. Connections have to be rekindled. I know I’m not the one to say this (being young and all), but I’d say to open her up first and gain an understanding of her feelings before diving in. I think when that happens - having deeper connections - things will go naturally.

You seem to have some swag in you. I believe, by the way you described the situation, you can do this without mones, but they may help. I’m a bit inexperienced to tell you which ones would do the job though. Sorry buddy :o, but I did read a few things about LMR mones. Check it out!

Good luck, and happy trails (literally, and figuratively - hopefully soon!)

3

Well, that’s exactly what I’m talking about. I really have no problem if I never have sex with this lady but she always wants to go down that road. It would probably put both our minds to rest to get it done already.

What’s been stopping her is mostly that she seems afraid we can’t be friends if we have sex and it doesn’t lead to anything more. I’m sure there would be no worries. All that hasn’t already been done is basically the penetration so what the hell.

4

I think she’s just abusing you as a backup for her self confidence. Everytime something “bad” happends she’s contacting you as a cure to her emotional disaster, most likely because she doesn’t have any real friends…

I’d suggest to give her one last chance, if she doesn’t have sex with you this time dump her, pull the “no contact” card… :slight_smile:

5

In your situation I would go with 2 sprays IJ and 1-2 sprays of tuth and say this “Enough of this already!!! FRIENDS don’t do this shit!!” and get up and leave the situation. IF she values your friendship or wants to screw she will contact you. If she has been using you to justify herself she probably won’t. This way you will know where you stand. Basically you have to draw a line in the sand and not let her cross it. That will at least counter the blue balls I think.

6

Dude… He never mentioned she only comes around when she has problems. They have been friends for 20 years. Life happens in those 20 years. I am sure he has been around during some of her bad times as well as her good times. If not and its only when she needs something then I agree high tail it out of there but we cant assume that is what she is about.

Misein, male/female friendships are tricky but definitely doable. My best friend is male and we have been friends for 25 years now. No he is not gay LOL There is a attraction between us, its inevitable but we both have clear boundaries and are honest and upfront with each other. We dont cross those boundaries. If I wasn’t married and he wasn’t with someone, I would probably be facing the same issue as her, risking a great friendship. Women look at sex differently then men. We are more emotion driven.

If she leads you into a sexual encounter just flat out tell her if you want to be friends thats great then lets keep it platonic but she needs to stop your teasing. If you want more whether its a relationships or just friends with benefits know that if I walk through that bedroom door I am not coming out till morning and until we are BOTH fully satisfied.

You mentioned you haven’t gotten together in 2 years so she has had time to think and work on her own issues.

Since this is the first time your seeing her in 2 years I would go with the AMMO with the other two. This way you will know if she is truly wanting to establish a friendship again or something deeper without to much outside influence.

Tisha

7

It’s not like she’s some emotional wreck or manipulative bitch in any way. She’s a great chick , she doesn’t do any of this to mess with me and it doesn’t happen because she’s on the rebound from some guy. I don’t mean to punish her or get revenge for her teasing me in the past.

What the hell, to be quite frank I just think we should fuck since both want to and that’s it.
If it doesn’t happen I’m fine with that, I didn’t mean to sound like I’m out to hurt her. I certainly don’t want to and if I thought sleeping with her would be a bad thing I’d make sure it never happened.

8

What else do you have?

9

Well, 20 years of friendship is a long long time. That is a lot for a woman to risk, crossing that line for them is hard enough as it is even though they are going through the motions for it. In her mind she has more to lose because if this turns into something that she wants more, then even if words are reassure there is still no guarantee for her that if she fell for you then you would reciprocate. Also, on the flip side, if she wants just FWB but afraid that you might catch feelings and don’t want the awkwardness and the whole letting you down scenario happening, then that could be stopping her.

I’ve been friends with this girl for a the better part of my life, over twelve years and its come to that moments more often than I can count so I know how that feels.

I’m a fan of A314 + TUTH, maybe toss in some IH along with it.

10

This was a very mature and well though post. I completely agree with your advice.

11

The source of her inner conflict imo is your own sexual desire, we as men can rarely hide our desire and even those that are somewhat good at playing it cool, lose it and turn into an 18 year old horndog once we think “it’s on”. In all likelihood she’s eager and attracted but when she sees you in full on “oh yeah I’m gonna get some” mode he anti slut defense kicks in with LMR.

Tricky thing about LMR is that usually once you hit it, it’s already a lost cause. Here’s why, you have three general schools of thought on approaching LMR.

AFC school, where you verbally address her concerns and try to convince her they are unwarranted. The problem with this is multifold…first you’re trying to engage her logical brain on an emotional issue during an emotional state. It portrays you as essentially trying to convince her to have sex with you which only makes it seem to her as if you’re Eddie Haskeling her by saying what you think she wants to hear…not unlike the losers that are willing to tell a girl “I love you” if they think it will make her more likely to put out.

Second method is the RSD school of thought…basically ignore the LMR and steamroll over her defenses with all the smoothness and subtlety of a bull in a china shop.It’s not quite rape, but it’s not that different. You may or may not be brought up on charges, but even if she doesn’t perceive it as coercion she’ll likely feel guilt and shame after the fact and experience enough buyers remorse to ensure it’s a one shot deal and your friendship will be a thing of the past. I’m not a big fan of RSD as you might suspect.

Third option is to preemptively bypass the LMR by throwing it up yourself.
First, casually address her concerns during conversation BEFORE sex is even suspected as being a possibility. Do this with some future pacing/time displacement. Very casually mention hypothetical plans for the future that include her. Nothing too romantic or serious, just stuff like planning an out of town trip on an unspecified future occasion etc.

Make sure to work basic attraction switches into the exchange. One thing I’m a big advocate of is possible preselection…by this I mean mention other women in your life but not specifically as sexual partners or relationship material. Simply letting her realize you have women in your life is enough, her imagination will do the rest. Being too obvious about romantic sexual potential of these women will at best act as a giveaway that you’re trying to play games and incite jealousy, or at worst offend her by making her think you see her as another notch on your bedpost.

If and when things seem to escalate, frame sex as something she wants even more than you do by going for NON SEXUAL compliance tests, and rewarding those tests with gradually escalating sexual kino.

The compliance should ideally be something based off of something she knows is important to you, like stopping by a store to pick up supplies for some kind of work or project she knows is important to you, compliance plus a sense of being a supportive part of your life.

As things get hot and heavy, YOU be the one to pull back first, this likewise takes her out of “prize mentality” and into “pursuer mentality”. Gradually go back to the heavy petting and forplay and do it again…think two steps forward, one step back.

Now as for the mones, you’re about the same age as me and my experience has been that guys our age can swap out Ammo and replace it with TuTH especially when buffered with A314 and a good social like IH. 2 sprays should be more than enough and in fact since A314 already has some none in it, the extra plus the steering molecules of TuTH in a single spray may be plenty to give off a strong sexual vibe without worrying about overdose.

12

How old is Miss STOP IN THE NAME OF LOVE?

In the BLUE BALLS MANUAL, article OU812, page 69, para 32, subpara 6a, that is a SERIOUS criminal offense! :angry:

2 drops of A314 and 2 sprays of TUTH upon your next TEASING SESSION. :cool:

P.S. Opssy! The Rad out typed me, so what he said!

13

4th option just tell her the truth. You have known this women for 20 years. You already know she is attracted to you. Be the alpha and take the lead. I dont mean by pushing sexually but just stating where you stand on the whole situation and what you will and will not allow. No friendship or relationship comes with a guarantee. She can take a risk or spend her life wondering what could have been but leaving you hanging half way in between is not fair to your or your friendship.

Tisha

14

Ok now you’re just talking crazy, that would never work… :stuck_out_tongue:

15

Good words Rad. I noticed you didn’t mention punishment. For example giving her the cold shoulder or shutting her out when she throws up LMR. I know that works, however it seems a lot more manipulative to me.

Basically by talking about her in the future tense you emphasize liking her tomorrow no matter what happens. That’s really what women want to know often. It’s the whole premise of LMR. They give up something that they know is valuable and they won’t think they have any value after that. So you either devalue it, which I don’t recommend, or you put the greater value on her as a whole person. it’s tough. Tough to do sometimes even when you are married once you become too familiar with a person. Trust me this I know.

Yea Tish, umm… I don’t know about that. The problem is men and women speak different languages. He could just be talking to her about having blue balls and then the next thing he knows she sobbing about him not appreciating her… I’ve seen it happen. I had to buy a lot of flowers :stuck_out_tongue:

16

I don’t like to advise freeze outs in response to lmr because it IS manipulative and most women will see it as a pouty tantrum of a “I’m taking my ball and going home”. It’s basically communicating to the girl that you’re holding out emotional closeness in exchange for physical closeness…nevermind the fact that it’s a fucked up gambit to try and pull, but it rarely if ever works.

I’d like to throw out there that I was only kidding about dismissing Tisha’s advice. It’s probably the best advice for keeping ones integrity to be honest. I will however say that I do respectfully disagree. I think that the woman will most likely interpret it as an ultimatum…just because it isn’t doesn’t mean she won’t take it as such. And I think it would still come across as an attempt at using logic to override a decision based on emotions.

17

Yea I agree with you. Freeze outs are manipulative. They make you feel bad too. Thanks for your opinion on the topic.

18

I have a 5th option: SHE simply tells him what’s up :smiley:

19

Generally I would agree but we are not talking about a new friendship or relationship. This one has been going on for a long period. They are beyond the point of playing the attraction games. At some point both of them have to take off the masks that all humans wear and be true to themselves and the friendship. If they cant do that after knowing each other twenty years its time to move on from both.

Tisha

20

My intent of my original post was along these lines minus the eloquence :wink:. It just seems like the lines of this friendship/relationship have been blurred and he needs to be straight with her and whatever happens happens.

I was thinking the IJ and TUTH would maybe bypass that LMR if the need arises :smiley: