Topic: Will excessive pheromone use impair one’s body to produce pheromones naturally?
**Discussion: In drugs like Crystal Meth, a chemical that is normally made by the body naturally (serotonin, I believe) is taken in excessive amounts. Knowing that the body does not need to make these chemicals itself, it simply stops. This creates an addiction: a necessary bodily function stops working because a synthetic chemical was temporarily doing the work for the body. The drug then becomes NECESSARY to human activity.
**
Topic, restated:Will synthetic pheromones eventually cause our bodies to stop making natural pheromones?
Please discuss! I’d love to get some insight on this. I’m not in any way trying to harm the business, simply trying to start a scientific discussion and begin a theory.
No, it won’t. The synthetic pheromones available for purchase don’t go into the bloodstream, and thus, can’t effect the body’s ability to naturally produce anything.
Meth, on the other hand, goes into the bloodstream.
That’s not true. There are negative feedback loops in the body that do not directly involve vascular transport. For example, if you eat something that increases the acidity of your stomach, parietal cells respond by secreting less protons, thus normalizing the acidity of your stomach.
That’s just one example. There are others. Unfortunately, I don’t know the answer to ajo’s question, but it seems like a valid concern.
This isn’t entirely correct actually, well, to be honest, not correct at all.
Methamphetamine doesn’t affect serotonin, it affects mainly dopamine but also noradrenaline. The drug does NOT contain dopamine though, when taking methamphetamine you aren’t taking dopamine or a synthetic version thereof. You are taking a drug which reverses the direction of the post-synaptic transporters with the resultant effect being increased amounts of dopamine in the post-synaptic cleft and hence more stimulation of post-synaptic receptors. Methamphetamine also indirectly inhibits the re-uptake of the neurotransmitters.
So the drug isn’t a synthetic chemical that does the same thing that dopamine does. It’s a chemical that “tricks” the receptors into re-using the same neurotransmitters over & over instead of using once and metabolizing them. Your body doesn’t stop producing dopamine though.
That was really hot. Would you consider having my babies?
But you’re actually mistaken. While dopamine is probably of primary concern in the pharmacodynamics of methamphetamine, synaptic serotonin and norepinephrine levels are also affected.
Also, I believe the permanent effects of methamphetamine abuse (such as anhedonia) actually result from excitotoxic death of neurons rather than a negative feedback loop, so meth use probably isn’t a good comparison. One very well documented example that’s probably more appropriate is the use of corticosteroids. Use them frequently enough and without staggering dosage, and your body stops making cortisol (induced Addison’s disease.)
Yes, noradrenaline is also affected, like I said. Serotonin is virtually unaffected, the total effect is pretty much neglible.
Rothman, RB. et al. Therapeutics and adverse effects of serotonine transporter substrates. Pharmacol Ther 2002;95;73-85
I don’t know if the actual aetiology of the permanent damage caused by longterm methamphetamine abuse has been “proven” scientifically. As far as I know it’s a multifactorial aetiology. One of the main causes is the down regulation of the post synaptic receptors. I wouldn’t think it’s a negative feedback loop, but then I never mentioned that in the first place
Uh, so what? Your argument is that because you don’t ingest pheromones like a sandwich, their regulation can’t possibly be regulated by a negative feedback loop? That absolutely does not follow at all.
You come off like someone who doesn’t really have any grasp of the complexity of physiology. Perhaps you shouldn’t attempt to make authoratative statements. You might confuse people who don’t know better.
Pheropro…If they only stayed on the skin, how would they then have any effect?
You may spray the phero’s onto the skin, but they don’t stay there, they are dissolved in a carrier liquid which diffuses The diffused phero’s are inhaled by you and those around you, and from there reach the VNO. That’s how you get the effects you get from phero’s…they reach the VNO and stimulate neuronal receptors
The skin is the larges organ in the body btw, it’s also used as one of the routes for drug delivery; Topical application of medications…
Ahhh, well… it seems that you were the first person to talk about intestinal digestion.
Pheropro did ignore the the respiratory transport function, but at no point did you show any consideration of it either.
Xiphoid was kindly enough to avoid confusing people who might not know better by not making a big point about the additional effects of transdermal absorption.
Xiphoid is a brilliant woman who should be able to handily convince you that are not the smartest kid in this neighborhood. She is considerate enough (usually) not to embarass you about it. If you continue to kick up dust and the scientific big dogs show up, you will find yourself grasping for your intellectual dignity. A little more modesty and a fair bit more civility would be appropriate.
If you make the effort to do the searchs, you will find that the phyisological effects of pheromones have been the subject of discussion in this forum for a good many years. I have compiled a long series of posts and threads on the subject but, in the interest of not confusing the people that are not aware of who we are here, I will keep this brief.
…and now you’re gonna want to know what burnout is.
I feel that I’ve been clear about not fully understanding the mechanisms by which pheromones operate. That doesn’t make it inappropriate or immodest for me to correct the logic of an inappropriate blanket statement that could confuse the original poster and anyone else who wanders into this topic, or to comment on other topics with which I’m somewhat more familiar. But if you feel the need to try to humble me, go right ahead. I won’t take it personally.
Concerning civility, you’re right, I was kind of an ass. My interaction with that person started with completely unprovoked rudeness on a different thread, and after a couple drinks I didn’t feel very polite toward them and carried it over here. I’m terribly sorry if I offended you.
Edit: “Them” being pheropro, not Xiphoid, who is probably the most interesting and knowledgeable person I’ve met here so far.
There is a lot more research that needs to be done in the area of Pheromonal science but so far the answer is no, they do not permanently effect your natural mone output or the ability to produce your own mones.
While some mones can increase the levels of different chemicals that effect the mood centers in the brain once you are no longer exposed to synthetic mones those chemicals and your natural mones return to baseline.
As far as health concerns which have been covered here before. No mones do not enter the blood stream but some of the other chemicals like the carrier can. They do enter the brain but most do not pass through the brain blood barrier. So basically synthetic mones are no more dangerous to your health as any other alcohol or oil based cologne you wear. Now some people have concerns about the toxicity of perfumes and colognes but this is something you would have to personally decide.
Now there is a company that has been into mone research for a long time that is working on using them as pharmaceuticals to treat different conditions. This company is the patent holder of A1 and EST
Technology
This link will give you a better understanding as to where those studies are heading.
I wish I had some of the abstracts to post here but my Desk top is down and I am using my laptop which I do not store abstracts on.
Concerning your rudeness… Androtics operate this forum as a learning center for those interested in mones and improving socialization . There are many people with different levels of education here in this forum. We expect respect to be given to every one of those members. So if you cannot control your rudeness when you drink I kindly ask you dont drink or wait to post till after your less intoxicated. We are interested in your opinions when given in a respectful manner but you will have to expect people to respond negatively when you keep responding in condescending manner.
Pheromonally I for you I suggest you use Ishine to warm up that part of your personality.
All this fancy schmancy talk is making me think that if we respond to pheromones naturally, could our bodies respond by producing different pheromones?
In other words… I get near my wife, my natural pheromones start getting all up in her bidness, causing her to respond and produce pheromones…
Just wondering positing that they could, rather than lead to “addiction,” simply cause us to produce the relevant pheromone in response… Just saying. I ain’t too smart.
well lets start fresh. Pheromones the chemical substance it self has physical properities and such is the effect on vno or other neurochemical receptors that count. after multiple neuronal synaptic firing the chemical around the neural junction becomes over time becomes depleted. now if this hypothesis is true the phero free days cause a marked reponse after restarting phero. i really dont care about arterial transport. what matters do phero cause neuro electrical firing and the pheros effect conform to regular laws of neurotransminsion ie upregulation, down regulation and such
Well, that’s how the brain send signals, by increasing or decreasing neuronal firing “messages” from one neuronal pathway/nucleus to another change in response to stimuli
I would be inclined to say yes based on my knowledge having previously worked in neuro research (not phero’s specifically), what I have experienced myself from using phero’s & from what I’ve read in various peer reviewed journal articles.
I can’t say about up & down regulation as that would imply an at least partially permanent effect, and from what I’ve read and experienced myself effects are transient. You can however deplete the neurotransmitters with heavy testing, or continous use without days off and/or diet & supplement to help your body replenish your levels. So in that sense I’d say phero’s comply to the “regular laws of neurotransmission”, increased firing = increased use of neurotransmitters but not neccesarily increased neurotransmitter synthesis.
On the other hand…there are members that report loosing the self effects from phero’s after longtime use whilst still seeing the effects in those around them. That to me points to tolerance to effects building up, much like you build up a tolerance to caffeein if you drink it everyday. After a while you don’t get that caffeein kick anymore, but if you stop drinking coffee for a while, that cup will once again give you a kick when you start it back up.
It would be interesting to see if there is any research done on this specifically.
Seriously, thanks for all the input and knowledge sharing that goes on in this forum. You guys are really helping us noobs, and laypersons to better understand what we’re doing during this whole process of bettering ourselves.
What happens is the drug causes YOUR NATURAL SERATONIN IN YOUR BODY TO BE SECRETED IN EXCESSIVE AMOUNTS… When you run out of seratonin (the happy chemical) you go towards the drug for relief of depression, then you feel a little better because the little bit of seratonin you have in your body is being squeezed out at excessive rates, but it’s never the same as the first time you use the drug… That’s why it’s called “chasing the Dragon” Cause you can never get the same high as you did before… And why people gain a high tolerance of mood-altering substances, etc.
I believe it is entirely possible.
For one there could be, as was mentioned, a sort of negative feedback system but I’d imagine it would work through your own olfactory.. Because your body recognizes there is such an elevated ‘cloud’ around yourself for a lot of the time it will adjust accordingly..
I believe this is the whole ‘getting used to self effects’ thing happening.
The diffused phero’s are inhaled by you and those around you, and from there reach the VNO. That’s how you get the effects you get from phero’s…they reach the VNO and stimulate neuronal receptors 
